Pap at the highest its 2500 and as bad as that is there are fascist elements unfortunately in all armed forces.
You’re deliberately smearing, I’ve given you many examples of fascism in Russia yet you ignore all of that and don’t comment on it.
If you genuinely think Putin and Russia is in the right come out and say it, stop hiding behind whataboutery and NATO expansion excuses, just say you’re on Russia’s side, it’d make it easier.
Sitting on the fence and saying you need to see all of the evidence means you’re on Putins side doesn’t it, were you wanting all the information and all sources for the Iraq invasion?
You open with “there are Nazis everywhere” and then accuse your opponent of whattabouttery.
Let’s just focus on the Nazis in Mariupol, shall we? That’s where most of them are and have been since 2014.
Yes but in the context of things that is your only like of supposed attack, you’ve mentioned the Nazis more times than in some books I’ve read on World War II, yes we all know about the Azov Battalion, its been highlighted and used by Russia but that doesn’t mean its ok for Russia to invade, annex and cause disruption otherwise unknown does it? Or does it to you?
You think its perfectly legitimate for that, I guess you’d back the Nazis to have invaded us because of Mosley and the blackshirts, its all our fault after all and we deserved it.
And no lets not focus on the Nazis in Mariupol in 2014, start your own thread and stay on topic.
If you don’t want to discuss this aspect of the invasion, you are perfectly able to not respond to the posts.
I think this thread is fine for the neo-Nazis in question. You ordering people about like a Nazi won’t change that.
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There is a huge problem here.
There is outrage.
And what will there be tomorrow? More outrage?
What about the next town at what point does someone say you are not outraged enough?
Where was this outrage when Alleppo was being reduced to rubble? Or anyone of of the Syrian Cities?
Yet the money sorry bribes, still got paid.
These scenes have caused huge stress in the EU core, policy has to be changed. It should have changed months and years ago.
What matters is not the instant reaction for the 24 hour news coverage, what matters is defeating Russia without being turned into radioactive dust, because right now? Outage escalation could be fvcking dangerous and most likely will not stop anything
There was outrage over Aleppo but the issue was Russia was supporting Assad and his despotic regime, it was a proxy war and Syria is so divided there is no hope, its a failed state, Russia only ever supports the shithouses, just look who votes with them and abstains.
You watching this Pap, you tell me that is fake, that is horrendous and I had to turn it off.
Syria was very divided when the Western-backed headchoppers were running riot.
Donbass was much the same for eight years.
What are you blathering on about, Pap you seriously need to start reading some books.
So this is going to run into the same issues that the UN runs into when its the West invading somewhere.
Someone involved is going to have veto power as a Permanent Member of the Security Council. Allows five countries to get away with literal murder sadly; more if they decide to help their friends.
Pap, we weren’t discussing the misgivings of the UN permanent members though were we. Can we stay on track with the invasion of Ukraine by Russia.
Good god the self appointed arbiters of who is right are out today. This thread has become unreadable tbh.
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Here’s where I’m coming from. We’re in a situation where our news is being populated with horror stories coming from very few sources, in a warzone, a fairly unreliable source at best.
Before today, I honestly didn’t realise how few, and how partisan, some of the people we’re relying on are.
At the same time, competing voices have been outright banned in the EU, the UK and the US. You have to be a poindexter with a VPN to get anything on the ground. I’m a poindexter with a VPN.
There’s a lot of stuff on the ground. That is remarkable enough in itself. Comms has not been blocked out on the ground. People are posting vids from phones and Internet all the time. The Ukrainians still got their phones.
Some of the videos I’ve seen are fucking shocking; too shocking to be put on here for posterity. Russian P.O.Ws being killed and kneecapped and shit.
Something I might consider putting up are testimonies from people that got out of Mariupol, who claimed that they were being detained as human shields.
We’ve not seen one account of this in our media and it genuinely isn’t hard to find. In the case of the punishments and torture, these maniacs are proud to be doing it. This isn’t a secret cameraman. It’s them, recording for posterity and bunging it out on Telegram.
It’s a war for survival.
They are never “nice”
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For a bit of balance, it’s not just the Ukrainians that have neo-nazis:
I’ve seen some horrible stuff also but I sadly believe it all but surely according to your own views they could be fake or staged or Russian deserters or Ukrainians?
Good for the goose and all that.
Don’t give Pap the truth, he can’t handle the truth, I’ve been saying that to him for 6 weeks now.
The winners get to judge the events.
For now, it is shocking and not unexpected.
On either side
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Its incredibly sad and I’ve no doubt absolutely none atrocities have been committed by both sides, the people who’ve done this must stand before courts. Will they? Probably not if truth be told.