Are all Ukrainians neo-Nazis? The Azov battalion are in their 1000âs and its Russia whoâve behaved like fascists.
What atrocities have Ukrainian been shown to have done?
Its matters not what you are shown Pap you either wonât believe it or give a but but but, I genuinely think you think Bucha is staged, the bombing of Mariupol, wife was a journalist Pap, I know a little bit of how the media works, I also know pretty much what is codshit and what is not, you can start by looking at your go to grayzone and see if anything they post is either fact or simply their opinion your mouthing and where their sources are verified.
Youâre not reading information or news youâre reading propaganda that muddy the waters.
The grayzone is a known Kremlin mouthpiece, youâll be quoting the South China News next.
Who said all Ukrainians were neo-Nazis apart from you? The fact that theyâre not makes it even more alarming that youâre taking the Azov Battalionâs word for things.
These people are not representative. Theyâve been preying on the Russian speakers of Donbass for eight years. You can see videos, video - right now - of supposed collaborators being punished in the streets.
I said at the start of this conflict that I am not taking anything at face value. I hope the Ukrainians get their country back. Iâd be quite pleased if all the Nazis in the Azov Battalion were encircled and destroyed first.
When have the Azov Battalion spoken to the BBC, New York Times, CNN etc etc etc? Youâre infatuated with a small band of fascists that have been absorbed into a larger entity, there are Russians in the Azov battalion you know? Fascists are everywhere, thereâs millions in Russia for a start Pap but they use slightly different names but the tendencies are the same, burning and stabbing foreigners in woods, anti immigration parties in St Petersburg and Moscow only wanting a slav nation (this is why they have a hard on for Ukraine also).
Pap all Nazis should be gone but solely using the Azov Battalion for you to question, deny and and post dubious websites concerning this invasion is beneath you, only 1.6% of Ukrainians voted for a far right party in the last elections, you should take a look at the Liberal Democratic Party of Russia, Iâd be interested in to know what you think of them.
Russia after centuries of interference needs to get out of Ukraine, it needs to concentrate on its low standards of living for the average person, the emigration and the low life expectancy, it needs to move into democracy and believe it or not thats the best weâve got.
The incident at the Mariupol theater represents one of the most suspicious events of the war, with both the BBC and CNN citing a claim by one local Ukrainian official claiming hundreds were killed inside the building, but producing no evidence to verify it.
CNN, BBC rely on single official pro-Azov source for claim of hundreds dead
Russian forces have caused widespread destruction across Mariupol, where they have been engaged in intense street-by-street fighting with Ukrainian forces led by the neo-Nazi Azov Battalion.
However, as this reporter detailed, the Mariupol theater was controlled by retreating Azov militants who were desperately appealing for military intervention by NATO. Several evacuees have claimed Azov detonated the theater to create the impression of a Russian attack that might draw the West into the war. Meanwhile, video of the alleged Russian attack on the theater has yet to materialize, and images of the supposed rescue of survivors or mass deaths at the scene remain unavailable.
That doesnât prove anything Pap, its simply conflicting stories, does that make anything Russia does as fake news and deny deny deny?
If Russia has nothing to hide why has it banned the word war, will sentence you to 15 years for supposed subversion and has stopped facebook and instagram?
Its closing itself of from the World, why? Only tyrants and despotic regimes do that Pap.
Lavrov and Putin must be thinking what the fuck is going on, why is there such ill disciplined troops doing this?
Lavrov and Nebenzya must be rolling their eyes everytime, they obviously know what theyâre saying is bullshit but they have to toe the party line, its politics Pap, Russia does not benefit at all from invasion or atrocity but the troops on the ground are doing this from Putin, if he has undisciplined troops with low morale then that is his fault.
And you donât answer a question with a question Pap, you answer the one posed to you first, manners.
That doesnât prove anything Pap, its simply conflicting stories, does that make anything Russia does as fake news and deny deny deny?
So the Russians derive no benefit from going out and committing war crimes.
Why would they do it?
What strategic aim do they achieve by doing it?
Your question has got fuck all to do with anything and Iâm not even sure it makes sense in English.
The only thing that makes less sense is why the Russians, who going by UN civilian death numbers, have been much more restrained than the West with boots on the ground, suddenly decide to bomb mosques, maternity hospitals and theatres.
Its unbelievable isnât it? Anything you say to him he doesnât believe as he doesnât want to believe it but his facts are set in stone, the theatre bit is distasteful to say the least, it been verified, in short Pap doesnât believe this war is real, he believes its manufactured and by design Ukraine and its citizens fault.
Iâm going to have to strongly disagree with you there.
@Polski_Filipâs recent visit to Gliewice should be an example. A war crime was committed. The rationale was to get the German public motivated for the already-planned invasion of Poland.
Now, if we can accept that war crimes have rationale behind them, whatâs the rationale here?
Rational to the Germans (ie the fucking maniac bent on world domination) Irrational to the ROW?
If you want a rationale for this - how about to create fear - if you donât accept our occupation or resist in any way we are going to liquidate you - we did it in Bucha, we will do it in the Donbass - or you can lay down your arms. To create a set of circumstances so horrific that capitulation is more preferable.
This is their tactic here, as they canât take the cities and have been pushed back theyâll simply pound and destroy indiscriminately hoping this will wear down (it will eventually) the Ukrainians, the Russians donât care for human rights, look at what they did is Aleppo and Grozny, they razed them to the ground, Mariupol is reportedly worse than both so I can not begin to imagine the conditions.
And yet people squirm looking for any caveats or loopholes to still propel their point of view.
And presumably you feel it is likelier that the Russians are doing this than the Ukrainian militias?
I find that something of a stretch. Again, going by the UNâs estimates for civilian deaths, you could argue that the Russians have shown more restraint as an invasion force than most. Indeed, theyâve gone out of their way to depict themselves as such.
Whether that is true or not, deliberately going after civilians, deliberately committing war crimes seems rather counter-productive to the image they are trying to convey.
At the same time, youâve got nationalist nutters punishing people they see as collaborators in the streets and the Azov crowd who have been ripping up the Donbass for eight years, and have lots of previous form for going after civilians.
Given some of the facts on the ground, what do you reckon is more likely?
A Russia that has hitherto tried its best to avoid civilian casualties suddenly Hitlering up and deciding to commit war crimes because their tanks and invasion force arenât scary enough?
Or a bunch of nationalist neo-Nazis that have been doing the same things for years in a culture of war, paranoia and collaboration? Whoâve been Hitlered up for some time?
Really? You believe that? What proof do you have to substantiate such a view.
Pap the Russians have never been concerned about what others think of them, this isnât China.
Can you further this and this is and Iâll be honest here quite dangerous views to hold, youâre casting the whole of Ukraine as fascist, Pap Iâd stop and reconsider what youâre posting here.