Yeah, weāve put it in the Labour thread.
I donāt like commenting on it in general as I donāt believe Corbyn was anti-semetic, and a bit like BLM, I donāt feel like I have enough knowledge and background, or skin in the game, to comment on it.
Seth Rogen and Marc Maron having a very frank discussion about Israel. Fair fucking play, lads. Iāve long argued that some of the best, and most effective criticism of the Israeli state comes from Jewish commentators, some of the absolute best coming from within Israel itself.
I found this part particularly interesting:-
Among Zionists, there is anxiety that North American Jews, who could possibly outnumber Israeli Jews, are becoming less supportive of the Jewish state, even as surveys often show the opposite.
Itās interesting because Zionism is a project predicated on getting Jewish people to move to Israel, with the ideal being getting everyone to move there. That is never going to happen. The diaspora is in general, doing very well and has never had more people looking out for them. In North America, Jewish folk are the top-performing socio-economic group.
Yes, I read that article. Very interesting I thought.
This will have the Zionists tying themselves in knots. Just imagine if a non Jewish actor had said this. He would immediately have been labeled an anti-semite, with all that would entail for his career.
That Yoav Shamir film I often cite makes it very clear that Israel is the back up plan for the North American diaspora, not the destinataion.
If the shit hits the fan, Israel is there, is the logic.
The mere existence of Jewish people doing well outside of the context of Israel is a threat to Israel. That is something the early Zionists never considered, because they had a legitimate wish for a homeland after centuries of persecution, and faced virile actual antisemitism that prevented them from reaching whatever they might be capable of being and put them in physical danger just for being Jewish.
That is still, sadly, a depressing reality in many parts of the world. I donāt think itās a problem in America, and that is a view that will be shared by those that have the lived experience of being Jewish in America.
I think there will come a time when itās felt the safety net is no longer required. It will be very interesting to see how the Israeli government responds to that.
Regarding antisemitism in the US, Rogen may not concur:
[quote=]
The pair talked and joked at length about Israel and also spoke about antisemitism, which Rogen said remains pervasive and prevalent.
āI remember my dad frankly telling me, āPeople hate Jews. Just be aware of that. They just do.ā And itās honestly something that I am so glad was instilled in me from a young age. Because if it wasnāt, I would constantly be shocked at how much motherfuckers hate Jews.ā
[/quote]
Iāve listened to the podcast. Iād recommend all do the same. It is as funny as shit, brutally frank, and yep, this was said. Having done so, I canāt entirely accept the Guardianās context. Itās alright, but itās not great.
I think the podcast is a darn sight better than that. In the abstract, itās about two dudes with a shared cultural perspective railing against some of the dogma and taboos theyāve become inured to.
Both get kudos for mentioning specifics, and while I completely accept that is what Rogen said, both participants also said they would never move to Israel. Rogen went as far as saying it was a long time since heād met a nice Israeli.
Hints of what happened toward the end of the South African regime? It does feel a bit like that.
Fascinating vid.
Strange people.
I was on a flight from New York back to London once when an Orthodox Jew refused to sit next to a woman so they moved him to the emergency exit row where I was sitting and then just as the plane started to taxi off the stand he stood up and started to pray. On being told to sit down by the stewardess he said āyou cannot talk to me like that Ćæou are a female and I am prayingā he then got told to āsit the fuck down you fuckin twat the rest of us want to fly out of hereā for some reason he did not try to speak to me on the rest of the journey. He did sit down though.
Rebuked eh? That will show them!
Is this thread anti-semitic?
Iām sensing a theme here.
Read the thread title again.
Itās about Israel.
Remember the phrase āa good time to bury bad newsā?
āA good time to perform illegal annexationsā.
Thereās a long history of most people in Israel being pissed off with the ultra-Orthodox. Apparently, many of them do not work. The recent fuss was over military service, not something the ultra-Orthodox have been traditionally involved in.
There is a huge divide between the tolerant and progressive Jews and the Ultra Orthodox, one wants relations and a two state solution and actually cares what the Worlds thinks of Israel and Palestine and the other are a shower of religious zealots.