Explosions at the Manchester Evening News Arena

He can say it is unacceptable until you are blue in the face, it wont bring any of the victims back. What I am saying is that we have always lived in a world where shit happens and it always will. We cant stop people from killing or raping or stealing. No it is not accpetable, nor is it preventable. Is it acceptable that people die in road accidents every day? Of course not but no one suggests that we ban motor vehicles. We just get on with it and hope we are not a victim.

Unless you can come up with a cunning plan that stop humans killing each other (either intentionally or unintentionally)?

But why is this happening, this method and why is it happening all across Europe?
Road accidents don’t count as terrorism do they?
Accepting terrorism as an everyday part of life is incredibly depressing and I don’t think it will wash, you accept it?
You accept terrorism?

Who’s accepting? I’m pretty sure it’s Illegal b.

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Yes road accidents happen all the time everywhere and we accept the death toll. It seems that is acceptable as we like our cars and motor bikes.

As for terrorism, it has been going on for thousands of years. It will continue to go an long after we are both dead. Accept it or not, it happens and will continue to happen as long as the human race exists.

So its not acceptable but we do nothing about it as its well life and that’s all there is to it?

What a depressing thought, we simply allow ourselves to be terrorised as its life and shit happens.

We do loads about it! I got a speeding fine only last week. Plus you hear quite often bout ppl get arrested on Terror Charges.

Playing catch up though isn’t it.

If we did nothing about it we wouldn’t be selling bombs to Saudi Arabia to bomb Yemen or supporting |SIS/Al Qeaeda in Syria to secure Regime change. In fact doing nothing would be a fuck load better than what we are actually doing.

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Saudi financed ISIS and ISIS bomb us because we sell bombs to Saudi?

Is that what you’re saying?

I think he’s saying the UK never had a problem with Islamic extremists committing atrocities before we started invading, bombing Islamic countries.

I think he’s also saying that our strident and hypocritical support of aggressor states is also a factor.

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I posted this over on SWF but it’s probably worth repeated here.

Every outrage provokes an anti-Muslim backlash… which feeds further alienation/radicalisation. And where that backlash impacts on the vast, vast majority of normal, law-abiding Muslims (and, in the eyes of ISIS, even more deserving of death than the infidel Western crusaders) the happier they are. It’s been working for them for a while now, and I’m sure it will carry on working for them into the future. They really want a massive backlash and to saw division - that seems to be their ultimate aim. Urge outrageous the atrocity, the bigger the backlash and the closer they get to their goal.

Here’s an interesting article on how ISIS are looking to “eliminate the ‘greyzone’ of peaceful coexistance” between Muslims and non-Muslims in the West.

Ok, by that then if we take an isolationist approach you’ll think it will stop?

Name one aggressor state that isn’t in the region?

Also don’t you think the bombing and interventions have a part to play but also a rejection of Western lifestyle and democracy?

Coexistence is what exactly? Toleration but not integration, a word now used as multiculturalism has failed but can’t be admitted.

The United States. Invaded Iraq illegally and without being attacked by that state first.

The United Kingdom. Same deal.

Australia. See above.

Also don’t you think the bombing and interventions have a part to play but also a rejection of Western lifestyle and democracy?

I think you’re demonstrating an inability to step into another’s shoes there. Western intervention has destabilised the entire region, putting it at the mercy of agents and munitions that put people’s lives through a grinder. I would think the day to day priorities of most people living in those war torn areas is survival, but yes, I am sure that if they do find a moment to reflect, they might consider the stated values of Western democracy to be in stark relief with its actions.

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I wholeheartedly agree we should have never gone in and are paying the price now BUT also see some could use this as a vehicle for their hatred of western ideology and a opportunity to further their religious ideals.

I assume this is heading towards another islamophobic tirade. I’m not going there

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I appreciate that you’re on a constant quest to prove that there is an indelible, inhuman trait in all Muslims, @barry-sanchez , but your case relies on presenting the extreme as the norm.

Most of the European born Muslims in IS know fuck all about Islam. Their ignorance is one of the reasons they’re so easily recruited by those seeking to give a highly selective or entirely false version of that scripture. They don’t know any better.

The problem with our actions is that we give the recruiters all the ammunition they need to radicalise these people, who are no doubt capable of seeing the inherent hypocrisy of the West’s position before the recruiter even knows they exist.

The truth is that we’ve had a significant Muslim population since the mid 50s and that we had zero problems with Islamic extremism until our governments starting being extreme in the Middle East under cover of “freedom”.

Possibly another idea is that we get the fuck out of Middle Eastern countries and see what happens.

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Don’t assume, no its not.

Phil, how do Dubai and I guess the other Gulf States manage to avoid terrorist incidents? With all their expats, you’d think they’d be a target, but is there a reason they get left alone?