:covid_19: 😷 šŸ„ Corona Virus the thread for all your fears ā“

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I can’t refute anything you say of course, but there are a few earlier videos by Dr John Campbell where there are accounts of Ivermectin use in Australia and the US by experienced medical practitioners to good effect.
Not the same as double-blind tests but nor is the use and results fanciful.

This review on Ivermectin efficacy was published about 6 weeks ago and came to the conclusion

ā€œBased on very low to moderate quality of evidence, ivermectin was not efficacious at managing COVID-19. Its safety profile permits its use in trial settings to further clarify its role in COVID-19 treatment.ā€

https://academic.oup.com/qjmed/advance-article/doi/10.1093/qjmed/hcab247/6375958

I was responding to the suggestion that Ivermectin at a few cents a dose is comparable, or indeed superior, to the new Pfizer protease inhibitor ($700/dose).

Of course it isn’t. Ivermectin is $699.97 cheaper per shot.

Hmm. 3c for something doesn’t work or $700 for something that works really well?
Let me think about that.

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Booster jab booked :+1:

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I’m confused.

In your analysis you seemed to indicate ā€œinteresting activitiesā€ around Ivermectin, hinting that it might simply be about finding the appropriate concentration.

In your terse post, you state it won’t work at at all.

Which of your competing positions do you hold?

I think its effects are marginal at best.
There have been a lot of people using it, and if there was a truly robust effect then it would have been picked up by meanstream medicine.

Went in for a flu jab yesterday morning. An hour later got text asking me to book booster shot and got it at 5.30 this evening.

Sweet.

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I haven’t had this much needle action since that night I went out with Lou Reed and Sid Vicious.

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I think that’s a very trusting view given the amount of money involved. There are vested, aligned interests between the media and big corporations - pharmaceuticals certainly not among a list of exceptions.

As John Campbell says, no-one is making money off ivermectin. If improving your ā€œmarginalā€ results is a matter of dosage, I’d rather see that happen than bunging $700 per head at a multi-national that has already done very well out of COVID.

Yet this is exactly what happened with dexamethasone. A repurposed drug, long out of patent, that has become a standard treatment for hospitalised Covid patients.

Great; we should be using general purpose generics wherever they’re effective.

As I think I’ve made clear, I’d much rather take that route, which involves using known cheap drugs, than throwing billions at pharmaceutical companies for reinventing the wheel at great cost.

Would you say that the $700 Pfizer jab is 23,333 times better than ivermectim in terms of clinical outcomes?

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Its not a jab, its a tablet. But yes. If the clinical trial results are borne out in the real world, with the caveat that early treatment is key to its efficacy. If it keeps people out of hospital then its worth it because the cost of a bed for a day is way more than $700

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You ain’t going to win this @Waylander

…even if you’re right

Give up the good fight now

:wink::joy:

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France’s over-65s and those deemed high-risk will require a booster jab to use an anti-Covid health pass allowing them to take trains or go to restaurants from December 15, President Emmanuel Macron announced on Tuesday night.

France is the first country in the European Union to make the third jab mandatory. It is expected that the rule will apply to expats and tourists.

Compulsory vaccinations to access restaurants or work in certain jobs is one thing, but to access public transport???

As someone who is unsure of how protected they are despite a booster jab, public transport is one of the things that worries me most. I had the offer of a ticket to the Arsenal game next month at The Emirates. Getting there involves a tube journey so I’m not going.
And at this time the NHS app does not display the data on booster jabs so you cannot prove you’ve had one to enter Austria or Switzerland (which require them for you to be considered fully vaccinated) or now French restaurants and trains.

It is a looming problem.
Here in EU life is almost back to normal and the EU Covid Certificate is used for travel & by varying degrees in different countries, for access.
The problem is that I can only register for my 3rd Jab 6 months after my 2nd.
But my EU Covid passport becomes invalid on the same day, and the update process is not yet added to the app either.
We have a group due in from Malta next week who have just found out they wont be able to go home and are running round trying to find a fix.
It is as if everyone pushed a problem 6 months down the road and are now going ā€œOh shitā€

Watched that John Campbell video three times, just so I was sure I didn’t miss anything. It’s already being prescribed in parts of the world, so the data will be in soon enough.

The excitement around it, @Waylander, is that it’s a repurposed known drug with a known profile. While historically used for other conditions such as scabies etc, it is now being trialled as a general purpose anti-viral.

That for me, and for anyone not rocking the $700 is a good thing. I don’t understand a rational reason for shitting on its prospects, be it the flip-flopping here or focusing on one specific use, such as horse dewormer story advanced from CNN.

Apart from the financial angle, of course.

There are reports from around the world. So far these reports do not stand up to rigorous scrutiny. Rigorous trials are now underway. We will soon have answers. If it shows a robust effect then great, the world needs as many weapons against Covid as it can get. At the moment I think it is offering false hope. I may be wrong, the trials will show.

Did you read the article I linked to up the thread? Here it is again: https://academic.oup.com/qjmed/advance-article/doi/10.1093/qjmed/hcab247/6375958