- You didn’t need to do say that.
- I’m glad your wife was treated and hopes she continues to be.
- The 3rd World need the vaccine more than we or the EU do, we know this and we both know the World isn’t fair as we’d like it to be, we owe contractually the EU it would seem little and morally the way they’ve been the last 24 hours less, to whom should we give the vaccine to if we’re legally allowed to keep it all?
Why should human morals stop at a border?
FFS, its not about which countries citizens are more important… its about which people need to vaccinated first if we are to get things back to normal quickly and save most lives, as opposed to folks dying because people who are less vulnerable got it ahead of those who are…
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The approval issue is not relevant, all countries placed orders before any vaccine was approved, based on a best guess - in fact most countries hedged bets and ordered some of each… Of course life is not fair and we have pissed all over the 3rd world for ever and will continue to do so, but why not use this pandemic as a start to do thesis fucking right for for once?
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I didn’t say it was. I said that had the government diverted supplies away from the UK before our population was vaccinated, they would have been bitterly condemned for it just as you’re bitterly condemning them for not doing it.
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Nobody on here (I wouldn’t have thought) would deny there is a better way to do this, and it goes hand in hand will the fall of capitalism and globalisation and doing things on a macro level.
However, that option was not taken so what has happened here is BAU.
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Only if they failed to adequately inform… or more likely because out right wing media, like a good bit of foreigner bashing… IF someone said to general public, its more important that globally we get teh over 70s sorted first, the cancer patients, those with lung and heart disease… as soon as they done we can open the world again and get things moving, or we can all get a jab and wait another 2 years plus not being about to go hols or visit… We only have a view that its we should get it first irrespective of need, because we have a media spouting this jingoistic bollocks and folks lap it up…
So one of Baba Vanga’s predictions is that the Europeans are going to get mullered by a power from the East. I never really saw it, but the vaccine appropriation could open the door.
The chimp vaccine goes wrong, Europe if left empty and Barry gets to spend the rest of his days on the white cliffs of Dover, despairing as a new minaret goes up in Calais 
Some more Baba Vanga shit for this year specifically.
Oh, it’s “globally” now is it, not just the EU. Let’s crack on then!! Should be a piece of piss.
Its always been globally, (see post way back) but the issue right now is about EU vs UK, symbolic of all that is wrong with the attitude towards a global pandemic…
You’ll be telling us next that you voted Remain.
OK question to all of you and answer this as honestly as you can…
Option 1: we vaccinate all of UK by end of year but because in most other countries supply issues etc have meant deaths of vulnerable folks are ongoing, we are still prevented from travelling etc… and for those low risk younger folks who had they caught it would have mild symptoms have to consider the vaccine they had could have prevented a death elsewhere when they did not really need it as a priority… need to acknowledge that…but hey lets pat ourselves on the back for being British
or Option 2; ensure all most vulnerable are vaccinated first, meaning global travel is back on by summer 2021, economy is back in gear, back in pubs and shops etc
and we manage case effectively as we have capacity in hospitals etc to get folks in and out who are less severely effected anyway… and we get into a season cycle of vaccination of teh vulnerable by winter 2021…
I’ve said before to @CB-Saint I think. I don’t mind people taking a side, but I take more issue when people are incapable of criticising their side.
I think that there is a fair argument you might make about national interest if this were a straight-up trade dispute between two countries, but it’s not that.
It is a group of appointed Commissioners deciding things on behalf of all their citizens and throwing the weight of 27 countries about. For you, the collective strength of those 27 countries is the whole point of the EU.
For sceptics, the fact that 27 appointed mandarins have this much power is fucking scary, especially with its history of collective punishment.
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No Pap this has fuck all to do with Remain v Brexit… although it on the wrong thread. This has to do with the most effective way to manage a global pandemic versus national policies and the misguided jingoism that somehow ‘we will be alright Jack’ … when we wont. The only way to get this sorted, without unnecessary deaths is by considering the most vulnerable first despite the challenges of logistics and contractual obligations… I am not so naive that I believe its possible to do it right… but I am surprised that many dont seem ti give a shit that we cant and are happy with the ‘were all right Jack’’ attitude when epidemiology wont give a fuck.
Remember folks, the longer virus remains active, the better higher than chance of a mutation that makes all us vaccinated folks in UK vulnerable again… I am happy to treat the most vulnerable ahead of me
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Then we treat the UK’s most vulnerable citizens first and then it goes out to the Worlds most vulnerable.
That is the point Barry… its about time you got it. We dont need 300mil doses we have ordered and we dont need to vaccinate everyone ahead of vulnerable folks abroad… If we do it logically (and morally) it would not only save more lives, but would speed up return of the economy… but its less attractive to any party or institution that relies on a jingoistic culture to back it…
Well lets sort our lot out then the other fuckers can queue, we’ll dish it out, I am all for that.
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Well only needing 27 people to make a decision for almost half a billion people is pretty efficient.
How much more “efficient” should it be? One bloke?
I agree and expressed same concerns about mutations & what if your been dosed up & was told it will be fine…
I do hope I’m wrong but I dont think it will be fine
What a clusterfuck. Guess the EU just thought Ireland would be on board. Again.
Brussels has been forced into a humiliating U-turn in the face of outrage in London and Dublin after seeking to trigger a Brexit deal clause to establish border controls on vaccine doses moving into Northern Ireland from the Republic.
The European commission was forced to backtrack on its plan to effectively erect a vaccine border on the island of Ireland after both Boris Johnson and the Irish taoiseach, Micheál Martin, spoke personally to its president, Ursula von der Leyen.
Its not about importance its about responsibility. Our Government is responsible for uk citizens welfare. The Eu is responsible for Eu citizens. Are the Eu going to vaccinate every over 80 year old in India before their own citizens? This may be the ideal but it aint gonna happen. You can guarantee that when macron bothers to order vaccine for Tahiti that every French national working there will be vaccinated before the Tahitians.
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