Some interesting snippets from the above. Heās really not happy about plans to establish an EU wide border control force under the direct control of the unelected EU commission, and nor should he be. That much power should not be in unaccountable hands. Heāll stand on a platform with Farage, saying that it is more about the issue than any specific personalities.
Even so, if Liam Fox can continue making decent arguments, we might have a more informed choice. After the very negative campaigning making no significant difference to UKIPās vote share in Oldham West, I reckon Farageās best option is to cut the bullshit appeal to racists, and make a case on the genuine issues that the commitment to ever closer Union generates.
Iāll put you in the same category as @scotty then and agree to disagree.
We had the opportunity and level of influence to shape how the EU was governed, but in an exercise of what I personally see was arguably a textbook exercise in national self-destruction / petulance, we left and are living with the growing economic and social impacts. Some will be happy with that, others too embarrassed / self-unaware to admit it.
We really didnāt. You could possibly make that argument if we had entered the single currency from the beginning, (although the argument would still be false,) but once Germany and France adopted the Deutschmark and renamed it as the Euro we had zero chance of affecting the development of the EU as a governing body taking precedence over national politics.
Genuinely interesting piece, albeit written by pro EU commentators. Also interesting from the comments:
Part of the problem, of course, is our own disconnect between public opinion and the agenda of our politicians (particularly, for the most part, those who go to Brussels/Strasbourg in the guise of our representatives): in general, they are far more supportive of integration and EU expansion than the public that elects them there.
Arguably a similar charge can be levied about individuals who stand for election under the guise of being our representatives - remembering also that under FPTP the vote of most of the UK doesnāt go to the winning party or even MPs.
Their interests donāt necessarily align with the public - (see the current Tory Government).
I think its simpler than that- if you have opportunity to benefit from what EU membership has to offer, much more likely to be pro EUā¦ controversial as it was, its probably why the higher educated and younger demographics more likely to be pro - whether commercial opportunities or individual for work or livingā¦ also less tendency to be caught up in āsovereigntyā is everything dogmaā¦
Majority of folks vote for what will benefit themselves short term - not what will benefit the country or its people long termā¦
I agree. Thatās what made the referendum result so astonishing, itās the only poll I can recall in my lifetime where people voted on points of principle rather than financial self-interest. You can disagree with the principles, but nobody can realistically claim that the vote was motivated by financial expectations. Right through the Thatcher years people insisted theyād be voting Socialist, then ticked the āfuck the poor, lower my taxesā box in the polling booths.
I think flahute on here who basically said all those who voted Brexit were cunts because it ruined (at least made more difficult) his plans on retiring abroad - I am paraphrasing but that was the gist
Not so sure on thatā¦ still believe many of those who voted brexit did so because they saw fuck all in for themselves - or fear of being overrun by foreignersā¦ If more folks had more tangible benefits from it, I suspect many of those āprinciplesā would have been ditched for self interestā¦.
