:labour: New Old Labour in trouble

:labour: New Old Labour in trouble
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#3142

It wasn’t very well explained.

As you say, you received the JC9 stuff. Most people did. I’d wager that most people in those circles also know about Willesden’s removal from that list.

It caused something of a stir online, Galloway covered the issue extensively on his show. The long and the short of Momentum’s message was “don’t vote for Willesden”.

The Streisand effect refers to an occasion when the actor attempted to keep photos of her house out of the press. As an unintended consequence, more photos of her house than ever started appearing.

Basically, people will do the exact opposite of what you tell them.


#3143

#3144

#3145

Yesterday i read some interesting research regarding Corbyn and Anti-Semitism which shows beyond doubt that there is a conspiracy to undermine him by the Israel firsters and their lackeys in the UK MSM. When the words Jeremy Corbyn/Anti-Semitism were typed in there were absolutely NO comments whatsoever linking him with Anti-Semitism before 2015, when he became leader. After 2015 the UK MSM have managed,(as of yesterday), to have produced a staggering 6,300 odd pieces accusing him of this since winning the leadership of the party. It is blindingly obvious that the State of Israel are engaged in attempting to undermine UK democracy, aided and abetted by their placemen in the LFI, all faithfully facilitated by our so called free press. Just imagine if Russia were doing it!


#3146

Wish I could upvote your stuff more, @Nottarf-Krap. What I do instead is share it to the We Support Jeremy Corbyn Facebook group.

I have won two Nice Share awards. People visit this site because of you. Top fucking work, sir.


#3147

Great, but how many people actually read it though?

Certainly not the MSM

:lou_sad:


#3148

It’s getting really boring now.


#3149

Well, if nothing else, it proves Corbyn is electable.


#3150

They’re doing what their owners tell them.
There is no consideration for the intellect of the public. We’re thought of as dumb fools, that’ll believe whatever they put in front of us.


#3151

Guardian try to show balance. I was surprised.

Israel’s Arab MPs back Corbyn in antisemitism row

But they had this ready to put a couple of hours later. How dumb they must consider everyone to be.

Hodge signals Labour antisemitism row may turn into battle to unseat Corbyn


#3152

Here we go.


#3153

About time too. Dame Margaret Hodge next hopefully. Although to be fair she did let the cat out of the bag yesterday when she told BBC news, (edited by her daughter), that this Anti-Semitism row will only end when Jeremy Corbyn stands down as leader, confirming what we all knew anyway, the Israel Firsters couldn’t get rid of him by democratic processes in the Labour Party, so they resorted to outrageous and increasingly hysterical smears against him. This woman shouldn’t be anywhere near the Labour Party.


#3154

So what do you think will be the reaction if the CLPs merrily deselect all Jewish and pro - Israeli MPs? They will just argue that antisemitism is endemic right down to grass roots.

If I were the leadership, I would be telling the CLPs to just stop temporarily especially with the new proposed reselection rules about to be waved through. Why given people more ammo?


#3155

Depends on who’s reacting.

Those that would allege such charges are already alleging them.

Absolutely no problem if these accusations are based on any sort of evidence. Where is Hodges’ evidence for her outrageous slander?


#3156

This is where it gets subjective. Hodge would no doubt provide a number of examples which she feels supports her comments. Some people will agree, other won’t.


#3157

#3158

I really doubt it, for a couple of reasons.

First, consider the Livingstone affair. A series of Labour MPs said he needed to get out of the party, but their comments were all along the lines of “Ken’s comments have no place in the Labour Party”. No-one dared get any more specific than that, largely because we live in a particularly litigious country when it comes to libel and slander.

The exception, of course, is Parliament, where for good reasons, the standard does not apply. Hodge chose to abuse Parliamentary Privilege for factional reasons. She did a piece for the Guardian saying she stood by her views. She didn’t repeat them outside of Parliament though.

Ok, it’s only really political geeks like us that get the distinction, but the general public aren’t completely clueless about the broad brush strokes. The pro-Israel lobby was on much firmer ground when it was indicating that there might be some people in the Labour Party with antisemitic views.

The minute they started attacking Corbyn personally and with such ferocity, shit officially got ridiculous, and for all our faults, the British public are woke enough to twig that.


#3159

I am a member of the party. I don’t go to any members meetings (mean to but always too busy / knackered after work). So I cannot comment on any antisemitic incidents there. My attendance of party conferences were under New Labour and cannot remember them much.
So in all my years I’ve only heard challenges to Isreali government’ policies. Interstingly my mum has been vocal about this in a union and says she was accused of being anti semetic when she did.
I am sure there are some antisemitic people in the party as there will be in others. But I’d like to hear some examples. I’d like to know what was done about it. I’d like to know how many incidents have been reported etc.
Because what I can see if some people saying it’s rife with no back up to it. That Corbyn is one and racist but not seeing the evidence for this either.


#3160

The scale of any potential antisemitism in the Labour Party is worth putting into perspective. In April 2018, the party membership stood at 540,000. At that time, there were 70 cases under investigation. That’s not proven. That’s under investigation.

That is 0.00012963%.

So one Labour member of every 12,963 in the party may harbour antisemitic views.

This isn’t very scientific, but let’s at least attempt to work out what damage these potential racists are going to do on a constituency level. The unscientific bit is that I’m just going to divide members by constituencies. I know full well that the level of support changes a great deal, but at this point, I can’t really be arsed doing the legwork to get exact CLP numbers. This will do for now.

540,000 members in 650 constituencies breaks down at around 831 members per consituency, rounding up to the nearest whole number.

Going by the sums above, 1 in 12693, and taking the rounding into consideration that is 0.0064 potential anti-Semites per CLP. That’s why I’m not too bothered about the crude method of division. The numbers are so low that even a CLP with particularly high numbers is never going to muster enough support to mould Labour into a new version of NSDAP.

Sure, some will say that Labour hasn’t done enough, and that there should be more than 70 cases under investigation. I will say that if you look at the details of the cases already being investigated, a good many of them are going to be criticism of Israeli policy rather than an irrational hatred of our Jewish brothers and sisters.

Look at the cold hard numbers, and the hysteria coming from the pro-Zionist lobby looks disproportionate. That, unfortunately, is a term too often associated with that political movement’s activities. It’s unfortunate because it deserves much harsher criticism for pretty much every outrage it unleashes.

Fortunately, I think it may have stretched the bounds of credibility a bit too much on this one. The harsher criticism is already happening.


#3161

Well the only example she has given so far is that after calling her democratically elected leader a “fucking racist and Anti-Semite”, in front of witnesses, including members of the press, she received a letter informing her that she would be the subject of a disciplinary inquiry for her foul mouthed and slanderous abuse. I would imagine anyone on here who gave their boss similar abuse would expect the same. On Sky News last week she claimed that receiving this letter made her realize “how Jews must have felt in the 1930s”, “I remember my father telling me, Margaret, always keep a packed suitcase by the front door in case you ever have to leave in a hurry” In the hyperbole stakes that must be right up there with me, after stubbing my toe on the bedpost when i got up for a piss in the middle of the night, claiming that now i know how Douglas Bader must have felt after losing his legs when he crashed his plane!

To understand Margaret Hodge’s motives, the old adage, ‘follow the money’ is a good start. The family company, Stemcor, founded by her father, Hans Oppenheimer, is one of the world’s largest steel trading companies. The UK arm of the company paid just 163,000 pounds tax on a turnover of 2.1 billion pounds, or 0.01pc. Jeremy Corbyn is pledged to put a stop to this outrageous and breathtaking greed, and change the rules to make sure companies like Stemcor pay their fair share. What a disgusting Anti-Semite he is to even think of such a thing!