Jo Cox killed

Originally posted by @Rallyboy

I hesitate to impose on the sadness of what has happened, as a respected MP who actually had a passion for causes and worked for her constituents has been lost in terrible circumstances, but there is a worrying trend developing.

In the aftermath of this appalling murder there is some debate as to how it is being portrayed in the media…

It’s quite clear that if this had been committed by someone linked to Islam it would be described as a terrorist attack.

I completely recognise what you’re describing, and it is by far the first time that I’ve seen concern over this apparent double standard raised.

I agree, but I think the word “terrorism” is a more dangerous double standard in and of itself. This goes back to the time of the Troubles, but there has always been a separate and distinct legal track for those accused of terrorism as opposed to those accused of murder. The justice system in Northern Ireland wouldn’t do jury trials on the matter, for example.

Today, the double standard applies in what rights you have if you are accused of terrorism. A mass murderer will get the full benefit of the protection of our justice system, provided that terrorism isn’t included as part of the charges. Of course, the irony is that the person terrorised everyone he murdered, all of the victims’ families plus the community at large. The mass murderer gets judicial process. The mush who is found with a copy of the Anarchists’ Cookbook* is a terrorist, regardless of whether he has done anything or not.

* By that definition, most of my year were terrorists. The Anarchists’ Cookbook was swapped around on floppy disc a lot back then. Oddly enough, saying “ooh, that’s interesting” or “look at what the fuck they let you buy over the counter in the US” was as far as our super-villainry went.

But because there appears to be a link to the far right, it has been dismissed as a loner with mental illness.

In these cases I would suggest that mental illness could be the main factor to some degree, but there appears to be a reluctance, both here and in the States, to link attacks like this to the far right, whereas linking to Islam is a default setting.

And it slots right into a disturbing agenda.

I really want to find this link, and perhaps I will - it was not widely reported at the time. I think the biggest haul of explosives ever found in this country belonged to a white extremist in Lancashire, discovered during the height of the terror scare.

Terrorism really is in the eye of the beholder. I think a huge problem is that we’ve allowed others to set that agenda, and determine who fits into what camp. Reflecting, I don’t think that the term is helpful at all, certainly not from a judicial standpoint, and especially if it establishes two different legal pathways for the same base crime.

But you’re right - there is a disturbing agenda out there, that seeks to demonise Muslims and at the same time and puts white people into a category where they are almost unable to be the perpetrators of such acts. They’ve taken this rhetoric too far. It was barely tenable when all Muslims were in the frame. Is Britain ready, psychologically, to admit to organised terror in other areas of British life?

The sad thing is that all of this has been bred and nurtured by our media. I don’t for a second condone any action like this.

Politicians being murdered on the streets evokes some fairly bad times in human history. However, this country has been pumping out the same general message when it comes to Islam for fifteen years. We’ve all seen the racists crawl out of the woodwork, enabled by a general sense that it’s okay to have a go at Islam.

When you have a young, visible MP that campaigns not just for refugees, but also Palestine, in the face of this new age of acceptable racism, you always run the risk of appealing to complete nutters that buy into the rhetoric much more than was ever intended.

It’s pretty clear that if he shouted Praise Allah rather than Brit Fist it would have been reported Terrorism, but I do think he was prob Mental Illness. Stands to reason. You either Stab, or you Shoot. One or the other, not both. That’s Mental.

Edit: RIP

I got in late last night and saw this news after a very odd day.Funeral of a number at lunchtime followed by Coldplay at Wembley where Jo Cox was mentioned but at that point I thought she had just been wounded. When I found out she had died I felt sickened.

I dont know if the guy has mental health issues or not but what a despicable act of cowardice. I read the horrors that go on in America on an all too frequent basis and always feel glad that I live in a relatively safe and tolerant country. When things like this happen it makes your realise that some human beings, where ever you are, are capable of doing dreadful things to each other.

Fuck borders. Fuck nationalism. We are all on this planet together and in 2016 we should have worked out how to live in peace with each other and not treat life as an episode of Game of Thrones.

Desparately sad news. RIP.

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:lou_sad: poor sog, as if Coldplay wan’t depressing enough

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Has the ‘Britain First’ thing been corroborated or attributed to anybody?

An eyewitness said Mair shouted it as he shot her as she lay on the ground - in the style of a terrorist - a white British male terrorist.

That’s what was initially reported but I have also read that the gunman had no political leanings, has lived alone for 20 years, has a history of mental illness but ‘wouldn’t hurt a fly’.

Wouldnt hurt a fly but would butcher an innocent and defenceless woman,

I am in no way trying to excuse or belittle anything sog, just pointing out that all info regarding the killer is sketchy and that the BF thing seems to have been dropped or not corroborated (apart from in the Daily Star of course). It was one of the first things attributed to the killer but now seems to be being distanced.

The challenge is also on of education around mental illness. The problem is one of highly inaccurate association - because when someone who is mentally ill committs something bad, the ‘public/media’ portray it as if mentally ill people are much more likely to commit such crimes… The REAlLITY is completely different as those cases are extremely rare. 1 person 10 will suffer from some sort of illness on the mental health scale at some point during their life time - even at the extreme end, patients psychotic episodes tend to be managed, and even then not, violance is not a default… which is how it seems to be portrayed. There are 1000s x more murders and violence committed by criminals, husbands and wives, ‘terrorists’ eg what the media would classify as ‘sane’ than there are by those with a mental illness, but when have our media ever been happy to add context for balance? - problem with our media is tahat context and balance reduces the drama in the story… so we are fed bullshit.

The eyewitness is still repeating it on interviews so it must just be the media that doesn’t want to report it.

I wonder why that would be.

I appreciate that Goat, it is just that these things seem to get quoted every time there is an atrocity and you rarely hear people say that the guy was a total psychopath and they are not surprised he did it. Either these people hide it well and boil up inside until it all comes flooding out, or they are on the edge so much that people just get used to them and ignore the warning signs. Omar Mateen’s former wife was one of the few who has said that she could see he had big issues. What on earth goes on inside some people heads so that they can suddenly carry out these acts? :lou_sad:

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Cameron and Corbyn paying respects together and the seat will be uncontested in the by election. As it should be, but still. Always gratifying.

The only positive I can find is that at least we live in a country where this is still seen as front page news and is seen by 99.9% of the population as utterly abhorrent.

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£5 says that cunt griffen stands

Really nice tribute planned here, by Stella Creasy

https://stella-creasy.cinquanteplusun.com/email/jo-was-never-one-for-sitting-in-meetings-she-knew-social-justice-requires-all-of-us-to-get-stuck-into-making-change-happen-tribute-to-jo-cox-mp-e17-community-commemoration-event-2-3-july-1023

Just read her email which was quite moving. I am not here that weekend otherwise I’d be there. After Pap, Sfcsim and I old school mate Del Singh was killed in Kabul I vowed to get more active again. I didn’t as too wrapped up in work. Now in a more settled place and more time to get involved.

I was in Birstall today, filming for RTE news.

It’s a lovely small Yorkshire town. What the press don’t talk about is their impact, which is 10 sat trucks no parking spaces and shoving a mic into any local person faces.

“A community in shock” … They’re in shock because the Sky News 'Copter has been buzzing over their house all day and the centre of their town is now taken over by twats :slight_frown:

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