Bazza.
Russia has always had Syria as a point of influence in Middle East.
Their Military like Egypt bought Russian equipment.
Also the tasteful yet excellent Topless bars employed Russian girls.
Allegedly
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This will either be the start of WWIII or the end of the White Helmets. Which would UK/US/EU prefer?
https://twitter.com/Deus_Abscondis/status/983831879345295360
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Itâs a dire situation, probably worse than any I can remember, and I am sorry to say that the leading causes of this conflict have been Western powers, and not in a good way. Perhaps people forget now, but the war in Syria began after an uprising in Aleppo, one of the last places to do so after the so-called Arab Spring.
Most of the countries demanding democracy got their wish, if only fleetingly in the vast majority of cases, but we did end up with a load of Western friendly people in charge afterward, no matter the form of government. The West has been ploughing money through proxy against the Syrian governmentâs forces for years, supporting the sort of ideology and attendant atrocity that they say, and we agree, that we should abhor.
The citizens of the Western alliance are not only war weary; theyâre wise, largely because weâve plenty of disastrous examples of intervention being followed by failed states or ungoverned regions, magnifying a refugee crisis that wouldnât have existed without Western intervention. The destruction or consequent regime change sends people running for their lives, while ungoverned spaces allow transit through previously impassable areas, largely on account of there being a coherent authority capable of maintaining the territorial integrity of the state.
Itâs the perfect storm, and both sadly and predictably, the solution our leaders have opted for is throwing more thunder, hail and lightning into the mix.
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Very interesting, @goatboy . Mattis seems to be singing from a very different hymn sheet from the British government, and his last words in that clip related to stopping things escalating.
Our politicians are foaming at the mouth. His nickname is Mad Dog and heâs talking candidly, with a degree of sanity and respect for due process that seems to have eluded our representatives, elected or otherwise.
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Itâs a decent article, but it results in a reductive false dichotomy.
Assess it on the basis of international law, and there is a whole new category to consider. International lawbreakers.
Assadâs father was a maniac, committing grave sins against his own people. @furball has a lot to say about that. This Assad is Western educated, has a British raised wife, and during the Blair years and beyond, was feted by both parties as someone we could do business with.
Today, we do business with much worse and we say weâll have no business with him. Itâs fundamentally incompatible with the Western doctrine of regime change, which is a thoroughly unreasonable policy in and of itself.
How do you know that is true?
Of course, I donât want any intervention without a untied concensus, I simply believe the Syrians have been gassed a number of times by their own.
A chess piece in a proxy war, the Golan heights and Lebanon are Syrias goal, Israel can never let them have the higher ground, you must suurely know this.
Why do you believe that. SAMS and the white helmets are completely discredited and all western reporting comes from their word and badly staged videos. The OPCW broke their own rules and accepted evidence from the headchoppers.
I canât understand how you can see any of that as credible. If youâve seen stuff we havenât, link it.
Oh, youâre earlier claim about American shale oil is ridiculous. Itâs shit quality, costs a fortune to obtain, will destroy the environment(local) and thereâs no where the amounts being claimed, at least not in an economically viable sense.
Theyâre not going to leave the Middle East willingly until itâs sucked dry.
Here we are like Lemmings rushing towards the presipice because we are a âworld powerâ. What shall we do, send our new aircraft carrierâŚif we have some aircraft for it. 
Iâve just dropped Theresa an email to tell her to stop being so silly. (I paraphrase
Everyone should do the same
Hereâs a question for you. If we had unequivocal proof that the Syrian government had been gassing their own citizens in this hideous civil war, what do you think the US and Europeans should do? Anything? Nothing? Something? Is so, what?
I heard Diane Abbot (for it was she) on the news this morning talking about some vague idea of negotiations. When pressed on how this might happen, she huffed and blustered but really didnât seem to have an answer. When asked if that means we would let governments gas their citizens, she didnât really have an answer either.
Itâs an intractable problem, isnât it? She rightly pointed out that bombing Syrian airbases would be helping the maniac hardline Jihadists.
Are you saying no one has been gassed or are you saying that some one else (other than Assad) did it?
Surely that is what the UN is for?
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Are you suggesting this photograph is faked? And all the others showing Syrians in Ghouta celebrating their liberation from the Al Qaeda affiliated âmoderate rebelsâ? These people have been through hell, the women have been forced to wear full face burkas by these ârebelsâ, if they have their way Syria, a secular state, will return to the dark ages. There are 2 million Christians in Syria, what do you think will happen to them if these ârebelsâ are allowed to prevail? Whatever Assad may or may not be, before this American, UK and French backed chaos that has been visited on the country, using Islamic jihadist headchoppers, trained, armed and funded by FUKUS, Syria was a stable truly secular state. No burkas, equal education for both sexes, 50% of university graduates were women. Christians, Muslims, some Buddists, all living side by side. Christian cathedrals, some of the most ancient and beautiful in the world, many of which have been razed to the ground by these Jihadist nutters. Why on earth wouldnât the ordinary Syrians celebrate wildly after being liberated from these fundamentalist nutters? I know this is not what we in the West are being conditioned to believe, but Assad has massive support from the ordinary people of Syria. And given the alternative our governments in the West are trying to force on them why on earth wouldnât he have this support? A choice between living in a secular society, freedom to practice their religion of choice, women free to wear what they like and have equal rights in education and choice of career, versus living under Sharia law, women forced to cover up, no freedom of education for all, forced Islamic âeducationâ, etc etc. It is a no brainer.
The biggest lie of all is the one that tells us Trump, May and Macron want to attack Syria because they are so concerned about the innocent civilians. That is a crock of shit, they are cheering the Saudis on when they are slaughtering innocent civilians in Yemen, supplying them with the high tec weaponry to do it. Sickening hypocrisy. Our governments interests are purely for geo political reasons, the long and expensively planned oil pipeline through Syria being the main one. Which, of course, would pose serious problem for Russian interests. Also of course to deny Russia their access to their only warm water port. Russia are never going to stand for this, it is naive in the extreme to think otherwise. The idea that NATO and the West are allowed to have a sphere of interest but Russia are not is ridiculous arrogance on our part. Russia will not walk away from this challenge to their interests. The West is in danger of seriously embarrassing themselves, just watching the performance of Trump over the past few days with his infantile tweets is toe curling. To think that our Prime Minister is hanging on his every word, waiting for this retard to lead the way then fall in four square behind him like a good little puppy dog is a national embarrassment. No wonder Putin, Lavrov et al are openly mocking us, quoting, (very aptly) Alice in Wonderland etc, the totally inept performance of our so called leaders make them look like towering statesmen in comparison. We have a Foreign Secretary who, if he caught himself telling the truth, would immediately tell a couple of lies just to keep his hand in. An absolute joke on the world stage, and a Prime Minister who is frightened of sacking him. A disgraceful state of affairs.
The most pertinant question for this thread though, is given the situation and options for Syria, why do you support the headchoppers Barry, rather than the legitimate government who are fighting to stop them overrunning the country? Why do you wish these Islamic Jihadist fundamentalists on the ordinary citizens of Syria? Sad.
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Neither, just that we canât take the supposed evidence from the white helmets or SAMS seriously. Both have been shown for what they truly are. The OPCW also broke their own rules by accepting evidence with no chain of custody from the white helmets. It all stinks.
If i had to pick, i would say the headchoppers were given it by us, to use when instructed by our security services, just like we trained and armed them.
I keep seeing things like this, when i look outside the msm.
âThe Syrian Arab Army and with the help of Russian captured a shipment of chemical weapons destined for the Eastern Ghouta. These were British weapons produced at Porton Down in Salisbury.
Russian suspects that the Skripal incident is related as by their records, Skiripal was working at Porton Down as a chemical weapons trafficker in partnership with a Ukrainian firm. Russia denies attacking Skripal but admits he was under surveillance for his activities involving support of terrorism in Syria and arms trafficking.
Russia also confirms that there are British, American, Israeli and Saudi intelligence officers who were caught by the Syrian army in one of the heavily fortified operations rooms during the invasion of the Syrian army and its allies of the East Ghouta.â
And this.
Last week, VT Damascus received evidence that Americans, US Army Special Forces along with Israeli chemical weapons officers had been captured in East Ghouta. We were told that not only was a command facility captured with modern weapons but a stockpile of British made 81mm poison gas mortar shells, numbering in the hundreds, was seized as well. Videoâs were viewed by former MOD weapons specialists who identified the green stripe on the shells seized in East Ghouta as VX gas from British stockpiles.
The next couple of days might reveal quite a lot. If the above is true, either we have to strike before the OPCW confirm it, or we control the OPCW so completely that theyâll do as they are told(risky, unless weâve already set an example to those that might speak out). If the Syrians really hold our people, they also hold all the cards, unless our governments know where the evidence is and are planning to obliterate it. America have told the families of some that they died in other countries, so just a dead body would prove the lie. Can you imagine the outrage that would cause in America. Maybe we will see our governments have a change of heart and decide dialogue is the best way forward.
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