:labour: New Old Labour in trouble

I wouldn’t argue with that generally, but John Smith died in 1994, two years after the election that Major won in 1992, when Kinnock was still the Labour leader. So Smith’s early death didn’t result in a Tory election win, but it did result in Blair becoming leader, which many might regard as pretty much the same thing really.

Thatcher called Tony Blair and New Labour her greatest achievement.

PFI was a disaster but Blair’s government transformed secondary schools through massive investment. It saddens me that people ignore those successes.

I’m glad my kids were at primary school under a Labour government, but New Labour was obsessed with 50% of school leavers going on to become graduates, a figure that it was rocketing toward.

That was a big mistake, and was perhaps telling for Labour in recent times. With the benefit of around 23 years hindsight, that pledge to get 50% of kids to get degrees doesn’t seem too altruistic. It just seems like a cynical plan to create Labour voters, just as the waiving of the seven year preparation period and the dictum to “send search parties out for immigrants” was shortly thereafter.

In both cases, the party looked at a certain stat and saw themselves able to capitalise on it forever, creating perpetual New Labour governments. In both cases, they were fucking idiots.

What we actually got from those actions we got an education system that puts the kids of anyone not loaded into multi-decade penury, and Brexit.

The Tories are going to rip the shadow front bench to shreds when push comes to shove. So many instances of disloyalty, so many instances of anti-democracy and frankly, so many instances of being utter cunts.

The Tories have their next election campaign written for them by the opposition.

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Well that didn’t take long! Good to see the BOD have their priorities right during these troubled times.

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I think James O’Brien has some sort of allergy to being wrong. His body just rejects it.

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I know he’s the poster boy for Remain but he lost all credibility when he started weighing in with the Corbyn smears.

The fact that he looks like an unkempt ginger minge that has had a donner kebab smeared down the front also grates.

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So, Long Bailey sacked for sharing an article on Twitter with anti-semetic content.

At least Starmer is being decisive - much better look than the dithering of Corbyn.

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I don’t think what is in the article is anti semetic.
I’m still finding the whole anti semetism thing difficult. I just don’t see it half the time and I suspect that’s because it’s not there.

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BBC reporting it was the line about the restraint technique of kneeling on someones neck being learnt from Israeli special forces. If that’s factually true then I’m as stumped as you are as to why that is anti-semetic.

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Apparently she has been sacked on totting up as opposed to this incident in isolation

Plus I believe that the assertion that the US police learnt the neck kneeling trick from an Israeli seminar was false

There are some added benefits of getting rid of another Corbynite and “Pour encourger les autres” with regards to anti Semitism. Good move and the media wont be able to kick his arse for weeks on end

Yes it’s definitely that bit. I just don’t see it as anti semetic. Either I’ve got a problem or people are making out things are anti semetic when they’re not.

And I’m pretty confident that I’m not anti semetic. Some of my best friends are Jews.

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Apparently it’s called New Anti-Semitism. So yes, any criticism of The State of Israel or Zionism is now Anti-Semitic. A slippery slope.

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It’s a naked attempt to limit the freedom of expression of individuals, particularly when it comes to the policies of the Israeli government.

There is a massive difference to opposing the principles of Zionism, especially with how that philosophy has, since its inception, been a calamitous racist disaster in the one place - and the hatred of Jews for being Jews, “old” antisemitism if you will.

It doesn’t even stand on its own stated merits. Advertising itself as a how for all Jews, it did not admit African Jews until 1984, and they’re not being treated well today. Israel is an exercise in European colonisation long after European colonisation was fashionable.

Much of the world was understandably in support of Israel and had a great deal of sympathy and guilt for turning a blind eye in the thirties. Israel had the support of the left at one point, on some issues at least.

Beyond your far right neo Nazis, I don’t believe old antisemitism is widespread anymore. I think that’s the reason new antisemitism exists.

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I think it is less complex

It is simply a case of Starmer trying to win an election. Part of doing that is to get rid of any legacy shite and that means anti Semitism - if he is seen to be a double hard bastard about it then the media will shut up and if they don’t he can point to his track record

Corbyns biggest problem was that he didn’t like making tough and ruthless decisions - that made him look weak and ineffective- so far Starmer has looked anything but

I know that Starmer is not going to deliver that socialist dream that Corbyn had promised, but he has got a much better chance of getting elected and surely socialist light is better than Tory right

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