…and just look at these charictatures of Eistein… fuck me if he was not one the smartest scientists and humanitarins of the 20th century… I mean look at his Obvious thick tash and big nose…
3 Likes
Presumably the musical Oliver will now also be banned. And anyone who has seen it and admits to enjoying it is clearly an Anti-Semite. And don’t get me started on Charles Dickens. This whole non story is absolutely ridiculous, anyone would think that only the Labour Party has some Anti-Semites in their midst. The Conservative Party has always had serious Anti-Semites, at the top level, ie, Cabinet Ministers, you only have to browse the Alan Clark diaries to find confirmation of that. This whole furore is not really about Anti-Semitism, it is a co ordinated, last ditch attempt to try and topple Jeremy Corbyn. Corbyn, pretty much alone amongst Western politicians, has always been a vocal and committed supporter of the displaced Palestinians, and is not afraid to call out Israel for their barbaric and illegal treatment of them. Of course this didn’t really matter when he was just an obscure left wing back bencher, but after 30 years of anonymity he suddenly came from nowhere and became leader of the Labour Party. Ever since there has been a relentless and increasingly desperate campaign by the establishment, the Blairites who had their long held control of the Party snatched away, and virtually the whole of the MSM to reverse this and force him to stand down. From organizing coups, forcing another leadership election, the campaign of which plumbed new depths of gutter journalism. None of it worked, the worse it got the more people supported him. They are terrified of him forming a government, they will try anything to stop it happening. The Anti-Semitism label they are trying to pin on Corbyn has been tried before and failed, anyone who makes just a cursory check of Corbyn’s political career, where he has consistently stood on issues, will know that it is ridiculous. But it is just about all they have left and they are ramping it up. The Facebook comment he made happened 6 years ago, and he wasn’t supporting the ‘art’, he was supporting the artist’s right of free speech as a principle. But why has it suddenly become a major issue 6 years later? One of the anti-Corbyn MP’s was pointed to the snippet on the Guido Fawkes website from 2012, and they seized the chance to have one last go at unseating him. The usual faces, Owen Smith, Ruth Smeeth, Wes Streeting, John Mann etc etc, all of them the instigators of the coup and at the forefront of the campaign to undermine him. That they choose to do it now, in the run up to the local election campaign speaks volumes about their political integrity. They really would prefer to see a Conservative Government than a Labour Government led by a genuine Socialist. They will plumb any depths to stop it happening. And make no mistake, they have the backing and assistance from some very powerful interests, especially the representatives of Israel. The thought of a man like Corbyn, with his consistent support of the Palestinians, being Prime Minister of the UK must surely fill them with horror. Of course, espousing these views automatically makes me an Ant-Semite to some. Shut down the argument. Watch your back Jeremy.
3 Likes
Jesus wept its not Corbyn its the elements within momentum (the Labour Party has no more nor less anti semites than any other party), momentum is not Labour, they control Labour at the moment via their entryist method, I am not too sure Corbyn likes them, they can’t be controlled for a start and unlike the unions who are the heart of the party simply johnny come latelys who’ll melt away when they get their first mortgage.
You keep saying this. I keep asking you for one instance where Momentum has ever made any statements worthy of the charge. Your lack of response leads me to believe you’re talking utter shite.
Let’s have one piece of evidence, anything, that proves you are not doing that.
1 Like
And I said UKIP have never quoted Mein Kampf but I reckon some its members have the pages, do you not honestly think there’ll be radicalists within momentum who support direct action in Israel? No militant faction that supports a more blunt force opposite to the ballot box?
You’re decieiving yourself or being incredibly naive son.
So you’ve no evidence for your statements?
That’s fair enough, Barry. As the media shows, you don’t need it. Most of us attempt to try harder on Sotonians.
Entryism, I take it you understand it?
I really should remember…remove all subtlety and use single syllable words when disagreeing with you.
Quid pro quo - you spend your time re-reading my posts on this thread and tell me where I said what has been alledged (presumably you mean that Labour has been accused of being anti-semitic?) is true or that left wingers are racist.
Here’s a hint - re-read my first post (“I’m not sure I would be so confident. You see, immigrants are mooslims, stands to reason. And mooslims hate jews.”).
If you think hard, you’ll see that my post is saying a lot of the “Labour is anti-semite” narrative may stem from thinly veiled racism (Islamophobia from people who don’t vote Labour) being morphed. You could even extrapolate from this that the “hysteria” about this subject is people in a dying media desperately trying to sell papers / adverts tailoring their stories to utilise this emotional reaction (by non-Labour voters).
I stand by the fact that there are elements of anti-semitism in Labour, as in all parties. Corbyn just seems quite poor and responding to it - and his poor reaction has been seized upon for political gain by some and financial gain by others.
Nah, just bring a bit of evidence, and try to read less like a man ralphin’ up the shit he’s swallowed.
Who knows? Maybe you’ll get to a stage when appeals to inexplicable stupidity are not required.
So you can’t do that - good to have that cleared up.
From the outset, you’ve implied that antisemitism is a problem that Labour had to deal with. I asked when Labour or Momentum had ever done anything to attract that allegation.
You then narrowed the argument to elements within. I’ve asked for evidence of that. None was forthcoming.
You are now essentially reduced to the argument that there _must _be some in Labour, because there is some everywhere (apparently).
Simultaneously, you seem incapable of addressing the context, that this sort of thing surfaces before every local election (go check, I’ve had to campaign just after them). If this truly is the background radiation that must exist in all political parties (why must it, btw?), why does the criticism always fall on Labour, perhaps the least likely recipient?
If you want to dismiss all that, offer nothing of your own, that’s fine. There are no restrictions of freedom of speech on Sotonians. Just don’t expect me to treat your man down the pub level statements with any gravity.
Worth a read, @krg_
It is not anti-Semitic. No, I am perfectly serious, it really is not. Now, if a Jew wishes to argue with me about that, they are welcome to bring it on – the comments section is below. But I will not have the likes of O’Brien, or Fogarty, or any of a million other outrage-foam-at-the-mouths who are not Jewish telling me what is anti-Semitic or what is not. I am a Jew, and I have experienced the sharp end of _real _anti-Semitism first hand. I know the genuine article when I see it, and I also know a false alarm about anti-Semitism when I see it too. So you can stuff it if you are non-Jewish and you try to tell me which is which. The mural is not anti-Semitic, and this is why.
The rich men portrayed in the mural sitting around the Monopoly gameboard include the Rothschilds, the Rockefellers, the Warburgs and the Morgans. The Rothschilds and the Warburgs are indeed Jews. But the others are not. They are portrayed in exactly the same light as the Warburgs and the Rothschilds, but this is not because of their ethnicity, but because they are all banking magnates. Their portrayal is not anti-Semitic, it is anti-plutocratic.
The pyramid in the background is often assumed to embody the legendary ‘Illuminati’, which is often thought to be an undercover world-controlling movement dominated by Jews. But again, this is not correct. The pyramid actually symbolises Freemasonry, and the widely-held (and possibly correct) suspicion that Freemasons often give each other un-earned ‘foot-ups’ up the hierarchy.
Freemasonry is not a Jewish movement.
Did you read that article Barry? “a source” “alleged”. It’s mainly about one man’s very biased opinion. Look into him.
Do another search, there must be better than that available, or it would appear @pap is correct.
2 Likes
You seem to be arguing with yourself and losing here, pap. I’ll simplify it even further for you.
Kingdom Come (KC): “A=A”
Pap: “oh yeah, well provide evidence that A=B”
KC: “I didn’t say A=B”
Pap: “see, you’re full of shit”
“Simultaneously, you seem incapable of addressing the context, that this sort of thing surfaces before every local election (go check, I’ve had to campaign just after them).
Who’s dismissing it? Oh, sorry – I used subtlety again, my mistake.
“You could even extrapolate from this that the “hysteria” about this subject is people in a dying media desperately trying to sell papers / adverts tailoring their stories to utilise this emotional reaction (by non-Labour voters).”
This means the right wing press are using this non-issue to get the nasty righters even nastier.
“and his poor reaction has been seized upon for political gain by some and financial gain by others.”
This means that the nasty party are using this non-issue to get votes - and the press to sell their wares.
1 Like
Here’s a piece from Jonathan Cook, a journalist living in Israel.
1 Like
Actually a good read Pap - even the links within. Thanks.
The whole thing stinks, like a lot of things in the news recently (source: the media in general)
Have never heard of the website before though, but I tend to keep to simple pleasures, sport, Sotonians and porn, not necessarily in that order…
3 Likes
He’s written some pretty inflammatory stuff for someone living in the lion’s den, so to speak.
Wonder what his shelf life is?
Can the real Kingdom Come please stand up?
I’m fucking lost here. Were you, not two pages ago, dismissing a Jewish critique of this nonsense a “black friend defence”?
I’m having trouble reconciling that with the man explaining himself on page 139. I will admit, explained and broken out from all the parts where you’re calling me a dimwit, it makes a lot more sense. Hence the upvote.
And for the record, I never said that all left wingers were racists. It was a facetious point, in line with the Labour Party being the absolute worst party to join if you are one. You’d never survive a single public outburst. This is why I find these reports utterly fucking ridiculous, because the left gets more “right on” the farther you travel left.
Not dismissing it, just pointing out it’s not a complete defence that confirms zero anti-semitism. Helpful possibly, but not absolution.
No, but it does rather make a mockery, as do other accounts, that the Labour Party is not a safe place for Jewish people. Besides, that is not what they were claiming. They said that they were appalled by the Board of Deputies’ acts and statements, and at no stage did they present their case as a complete defence that confirms zero anti-semitism.
That is a standard that you are now demanding, despite having presented no evidence that there is.