The hegemony the US holds over the world is indefensible. Suggesting that the crimes of a small group of racist fuckwitts with body armour and guns does not equate to the crimes of Adolf Hitler’s genocidal jew gassing Nazis is just blindingly obvious.
The issue I have at the moment is that this is being positioned as being Nazi.
It is not that word that is the problem with the planet. The problem is EXTREMISTS.
Extremist Communists murdered millions in Cambodia, in the Gulags of Russia and the purges in China as much as extremist Nazis murdered millions in gas chambers and extremist Islamics murder millions in terror attacks or caliphates.
All extreme views must be attacked equally and people “reeducated” to integrate into modern society.
Trump is an emotive reactor. Bannon is a Nazi planner. Trump is incapable of creating detailed and consistent strategies to change society he is an “evangelist” who spouts the sound bites Bannon is the social engineer.
In some ways in his mind he is doing the right thing - trying to break the establishment is something the people want - look at Brexit 
but the problem is the person tasked with doing that is imho much more dangerous than Trump because he has a brain (albeit warped & sick), a plan, AND a media / political mandate
When even the right wing Fox News is scared of him we should be terrified
Next Charlotteville.
The council decided to remove a statue of Robert E Lee
Now anyone old enough to remember Dukes of Hazard know that he is an important piece of Southern Culture.
There were protests. Imagine a British cultural icon - say Gordon of Khartoum being taken down - some would complain.
Now there ARE two sides. The council & the public. Maybe a do gooder decided to start the protest & have a march. Maybe it was infiltrated from the word go, but a door had been opened an emotive target painted on a wall.
Defend our culture was the starting point. And of course that became so much more.
Obviously IF the statue issue had never been in play where would the rallying cry & permits have come from? The whole sorry mess would no doubt have exploded elsewhere.
The protest was so easy to target a just cause some infiltrators and bus loads of fanatics. It was a cluster fuck and hijacked.
All extremists do it these are simple targets as much “blame” should lay at the door of the person who decided Southern Culture was offensive it IS but there are better ways than attacking symbolism
OK, let’s try to look at another way.
Most would agree that @pap is as much of leftie as is possible to be. But going on your reasoning that’s a ridiculous assertion until he sets up his own national health service and provides free education for all.
His beliefs mean he would, if it was needed and he had the ability, just as these nazis would follow through on their believes.
Don’t confuse lack of will with lack of ability.
There is a danger here that the real issues get lost in semantics and labels… but in this caseIMHO these scum should be called out for what they are…
Nazis were a political party. That had an ideological superiority complex and racist doctrine. They tried to use racist science/eugenics to build credibilty into their racism. Their genocide came later… but its with that ideology that starts this shit.
It is not helpful to label all side ‘extremists’ in this case because not ‘all sides’ WERE ‘extremists’ and not all extremists are racist.
In this case, we have right wing racists of various guises causing death and injury. … (It should not fucking matter about the statue - Sorry DP but suggetsing anyone other than the racist cunts had responsibilty here is out of line) in that respect they ARE ‘NAZIs’ as their ideology is the same and they seem comfortable crossing that line into the killing of protesters who disagree with them… and I repeat, messing with a General Lee (fuck culture he was a fucking apologist for slavery) stature is not an excuse to cross that line… So yes they are ‘Nazis’… by trying to find ‘lesser’ words for these ignorant pathetic racists, we ‘dilute’ the impact of their hatred and violence- the Nazis were beating up/killing Jews, socilalists, homosexuals, intellectuals, gypsies etc back in the late 1920s… and imprisioned for it… how is the hatred and actions of these ‘right wing’ and white supremecists any different ideologically… and now sadly how different when compared to those early days before the NAZIs came into power ?
Lets not get lost up in a debate about what they are called… its about what they stand for and do that should be challneged at every opportiunity, but lets not also shy away from calling them what they are and if they behave like the ealry Nazis, then we should call then that. We shoudl also acknowledge that this is no small minority anymore…
I’m pretty sure we could argue endlessly about the semantics of these words but to be honest that’s not really a topic I’m interested in and now regret opening that discussion.
What I am more interested in, is manipulation of public opinion by powerful people with agendas. I think such people are using this word quite deliberately to invoke a particular emotional response from people that will ultimately weaken Trumps position for their own benefit.
-
is it appropriate to call some of the protestors Nazis? Arguably, although I lean towards no.
-
is it appropriate to label all the protestors and Donald Trump as Nazis? Certainly not.
-
is it appropriate for murdering war criminals and their supporters to be the ones to level the accusations? Certainly not without appearing extremely hypocritical.
-
in terms of violence and projection of power are the events in Charlottesville comparable to the invasions and interference in the middle east and throughout the world perpetrated by us administrations and our own. Certainly not.
My concern is that people getting in a hysterical flap about Nazis, statues, localised violence and Trump are allowing themselves to be manipulated by an equally dispicable set of characters. “Yeah but the emails” really does not strike me as funny thing to say. It is fucking tragic that the only choices in the US and French elections were Trump, Clinton, Macron and Le Pen.
3 Likes
I think you are being too myopic Chutters.
I think we should be calling out Neo Liberal as well as Neo Nazi scum AND where they exist Neo Pol Pots and Neo Islamic Extremists.
They are ALL scum and they should ALL be exercised from Human Society.
My CONCERN is that people who “rant” in a gut reaction to Charlottsville and these vile creatures are actually reacting in the same way that the scum have reacted to Muslims and other sectors.
The outpouring of Bile bears similarities.
Yet nobody sees the similarities or then leap in with the “But they are Nazis” line.
They should ALL be treated equally by the Law and all condemned.
1 Like
Lolz, he does sound like someone on here x was bad then y says - never been there.
Again looking behind the curtain
Everyone rants about Nazi’s - (who Bannon admits are clowns - see below) BUT his other comments just to me seem to show smoke and mirrors - everyone is looking right when they should be looking straight ahead. I think far more dangerous things are going on than a bunch of “losers”
“Ethno-nationalism – it’s losers. It’s a fringe element. I think the media plays it up too much, and we gotta help crush it, you know, uh, help crush it more … These guys are a collection of clowns.”