Originally posted by @areloa-grandee
So pap, when are you going to storm the House of lords - afterall its a form of functional dictatorship , unelected and unaccountavble to the British public… or maybe a better comparison is the UK Civil Service - Unelected beurocrats, wasteful, inefficient etc…
Couple of things.
- Immigration policy - the issue of capacity re public services is total bollox… with respect to NHS, given we have some 7-9% of NHS stafff from the EU, their taxation contribution is less than the cost of providing health care to EU migrants… I will say again, comoditizing people in trems of skills and points to fulfill quotas is simply wrong - success for migrants should be down to their comittment and hard work, not how many points they score…
Capacity is an issue across the board. I’ve just been watching yesterday’s PMQs. Gordon Brown, for all his faults, introduced a Migrant Impact Fund aimed at reducing stresses on local economies particularly affected by migration. The Tories abolished it.
It’s not just the NHS. It’s the demand on the housing market, schools, translation services, depression of wages for working people to the point where they need to be renumerated by the government.
I have zero problem with unlimited migration if the money is there to build the infrastructure. It isn’t, that wasn’t the deal that Cameron brought back, therefore it is a concern.
And for all the tax neutral or positive assessments that economists produce, few of them will measure what has been lost in the process, such as a living wage, or the vast sums paid out in Housing Benefit to landlords enjoying a low supply market.
- Workers rights - we already sadly have a diluted version of the protection afforded to EU workers. The rights we have have been down to EU legislation and do you really believe that a UK Government that will inevitably lurch to the right is going to give a fuck about protecting rights of workers that was developed by the EU?
Complete shit, I’m afraid.
TUC general secretary Frances O’Grady claimed, “It’s the EU that guarantees workers paid holidays, parental leave and equal treatment of part-timers.”
In reality, it was the unions that O’Grady leads that won those rights.
Their struggles mean that some British workplace legislation, such as health and safety, is stronger than the EU demands.
The Health and Safety at Work Act 1974 came out of a mass upsurge in union struggle that toppled Edward Heath’s Tory government.
It’s been under relentless Tory attack. But the EU’s “Better Regulation” agenda won’t give workers more protection. It makes clear that “suppressing unnecessary administrative burdens” is crucial for business.
The Equal Pay Act, which formally guarantees equal pay, had nothing to with the EU. A Labour government introduced it in 1970 after women machinists at Ford’s Dagenham plant in east London went on all-out strike.
The Equal Pay Act is now largely superseded by the Equality Act of 2010—legislation that would remain after a “Brexit”.
Much of EU employment law has also been implemented through British legislation, and is often stronger than the EU requires. For instance, the EU’s minimum annual holiday period is four weeks, yet in Britain it’s 5.6 weeks.
EU directives on maternity leave guard against some discrimination and all women are entitled to
14 weeks’ leave. But parents in Britain can qualify for up to 50 weeks of shared leave, 37 of which are paid.
https://socialistworker.co.uk/art/42434/Six+myths+about+the+European+Union
Just this year, the Conservatives have attempted to attack workers’ rights through the Trade Union Bill. It was Labour that opposed that. The EU did nothing.
As has been repeatedly said: there is a fuck load wrong with the EU. Including elements that are undemocratic and possibly in places, worse… but to think that Leave will improve the rights of people is naive at best.
Leave is a campaign to get the UK out of the EU. It is not a government. Businesses will continue to try to attempt erode workers rights. Ironically, the EU, what with its unelected executive, is the ideal place to dispense such policies.
We can vote out governments that create policy we don’t like in general elections. This is our one chance to _offer an opinion _on whether we want that level of unaccountable control sitting over us.
If the British people really believe in all that is good about Britain, our sense of fairplay, decency and rights… then lets go back to a bit of good old fashioned emperalist justification… lets get these jumped up Eurocrats to play by our rules… by forcing through change - You dont run away from something because its shit… you stand up and fight for change, highlight what is shit and LEAD the change from within - however slowly it is, nothing worth it every came easy.
The UK has been hugely influential in the EU, just not in ways that many of its citizens would find attractive. We have been instrumental in creating many of the business friendly regulations. We have been praised by our European centre right colleagues for bringing market principles in.
Unfortunately, the UK has been led by Thatcherite principles since 1979.
If out MEPs are not doing this, then lets take their selection more fucking seriously and make them accountable.
An MEPs job is to make a little speech, then say yes or no on an issue.
That’s it. They don’t direct any legislation. They just get to sign off on law the unelected EU commission creates.
But ultimately, I still cant get away form the sad fact that for many this decision will be driven by the fear of migrants… of the country being ‘overwhelmed’ by freeloaders or those steeling our jobs… well you cant have it both ways, because if some of the bollox is to believed we should just stay in as the EU will make sure all our jobs go abroad so there will be no incentive for migrants to come here anyway… a facetious comment maybe, but there it shows the idiotic contradictions in some the rhetoric spouted.
Leave and IMHO, we throw away our chance to drivers of change… and we will be making a symbolic statement about our view on migration that I find hard to stomach… am I wrong to focus on this one issue, whne its the one that I suspect the majority of LEAVES will be using to justify their perspective?
Remain and IMHO, we validate this corrupt enterprise and set it in stone, waiting for the miracle of a centre-left government in affluent Germany before any genuine reform is possible, while a far right party makes huge gains in France, despite all attempts to stop it.
There’s no implied statement about migration. That’s a guilt trip I refuse to go on, although many will fall for it.
