I think it’s much more the case that Johnson simply doesn’t know what to do, plus of course he isn’t (yet) prime minister.
Any of his quotes.
Originally posted by @Fowllyd
I think it’s much more the case that Johnson simply doesn’t know what to do, plus of course he isn’t (yet) prime minister.
Possibly expected Cameron to begin the process and involve him. As you point out, he now has to win the leadership.
I signed it.
Not because I think we’ll get another referendum, because, for the reasons you state, that would be silly. Where does it stop?
But I needed to vent, and that gave me an opportunity.
I’d also hope that it would influence our politicians in their negotiations with the remaining states, and in shaping the new laws that will be made to replace the EU-influenced legislation we currently have in many areas of our lives.
With such a small majority, any party that goes whole-heartedly isolationist against the will of 40%+ of those that voted in the referendum will feel a backlash at some point.
Those 2 million signatures will hopefully serve as a reminder.
5 Likes
More to the point who would want it apart from Boris from what I can see nobody on thec onservative side apart from Boris has the gumption or personality to hold the whole thing together.
Originally posted by @saintbletch
Originally posted by @CB-Saint
2 million signatures for a second referendum
Well, I have to say, this is line with EU procedure is the advent of an adverse result.
Also, if we voted to leave again, would we need a third?
I signed it.
Not because I think we’ll get another referendum, because, for the reasons you state, that would be silly. Where does it stop?
But I needed to vent, and that gave me an opportunity.
I’d also hope that it would influence our politicians in their negotiations with the remaining states, and in shaping the new laws that will be made to replace the EU-influences legislation we currently have in many areas of our lives.
With such a small majority, any party that goes whole-heartedly isolationist against the will of 40%+ of those that voted in the referendum will feel a backlash at some point.
Those 2 million signatures will hopefully serve as a reminder.
Very few people want isolationism even on the brexit side. europe won’t want UK islationism. There will be some renegotiation whereby everyone saves face, but we could have had the bulk of it without a referendum or the economic blip and that would have been enough to head off an exit vote.
2 Likes
A cynic might say that is what we’ve just voted for.
But that would do your argument a disservice so I’ll not forward that point of view.
I will say that with respect, you don’t talk actually talk for the people on the Brexit side - such that you can quantify those that have that view. I should also acknowledge that you could be correct.
But whilst that might be your sense now, after 6 months of the remaining EU states playing hardball in divorce settlements, and with the certain divisions that will appear within our country (as they have on this forum), I could quite easily see those that voted Brexit with their emotions rather than their heads will be for building walls and telling those that don’t like ‘us’ to fuck off and do one.
Whether that would be a widely held view or not is moot, but we’ve seen that our politicians will align themselves with the prevailing sentiment to get elected, so I wouldn’t dismiss any possible outcome from this vote.
Absolutely agree with your last point. A referendum was not necessary - per the piece (I think) you shared yesterday.
1 Like
Originally posted by @saintbletch
A cynic might say that is what we’ve just voted for.
But that would do your argument a disservice so I’ll not forward that point of view.
I will say that with respect, you don’t talk actually talk for the people on the Brexit side - such that you can quantify those that have that view. I should also acknowledge that you could be correct.
But whilst that might be your sense now, after 6 months of the remaining EU states playing hardball in divorce settlements, and with the certain divisions that will appear within our country (as they have on this forum), I could quite easily see those that voted Brexit with their emotions rather than their heads will be for building walls and telling those that don’t like ‘us’ to fuck off and do one.
Whether that would be a widely held view or not is moot, but we’ve seen that our politicians will align themselves with the prevailing sentiment to get elected, so I wouldn’t dismiss any possible outcome from this vote.
Absolutely agree with your last point. A referendum was not necessary - per the piece (I think) you shared yesterday.
I’ll grant you I can only offer anecdotal evidence.
But even the worst guy channel 4 could find, who was completely disinterested in the sovereignty debate said he was OK with europeans coming here.
My assessment of all the prominent leave campaigns is that they are not isolationist. none of the leave voters I encounter are isolationist. The real rotten stuff all turns up on progressive media.
At the very least I feel confident that there would not be popular support for isolationism.
2 Likes
This is one holy mess and all because self-serving politicians on both sides didn’t have the sense or guts to run a campaign based on TRUTH.
I’ve never trusted a politician to tell the ungilded truth and I see a lot more people are joining me.
Send £5 and an SAE for my pamphlet, “Where To Next”
5 Likes
Needs to top up the pension now Slowy? 
1 Like
I won’t sign it . Because despite what some may think of my views, I do respect a democratic decision. I am merely fucking angry at those who voted that way for reasons of ignorance on immigration and who fell for shit like 350mil now suddenly available per week extra for the NHS… And whatever some of you think, I suspect that the numer that voted for that shit was more than enough to make the difference.
1 Like
Interestingly Merkel is already making concilatory noises
Meanwhile on negotiations, German Chancellor Angela Merkel said: “It shouldn’t take forever, that’s right, but I would not fight for a short time frame.”
She added that she was seeking a “objective, good” climate in talks on Britain’s exit from the EU, and that there was no need to make deterrence a priority.
Mrs Merkel also said there was “no need to be particularly nasty in any way in the negotiations; they must be conducted properly”.
John Oliver, giving his views on Brexit (before the vote). Entertaining and depressing in equal measure…
There is an innate British desire to tell Europe to go fuck itself…
Also contains a re-imagining of Ode to Joy…
1 Like
bunkum all the way through? Except the bit you agreed with? And where you said Farage was not part of the Leave campaign so we can just ignore his huge and outrageous lie? And you just assuming we will be part of the single market just like that. Dead easy , no other implications? Wow
If Farage really had nothing to do with the Leave campaign (really? FFS) does that mean all the voters who thought that he was and voted based on his sick bile, should be discounted? Because a significant number did just that.
Originally posted by @CB-Saint
Originally posted by @saintbletch
Originally posted by @Sotonist
Originally posted by @saintbletch
Originally posted by @CB-Saint
2 million signatures for a second referendum
Well, I have to say, this is line with EU procedure is the advent of an adverse result.
Also, if we voted to leave again, would we need a third?
[snip]
Very few people want isolationism even on the brexit side. europe won’t want UK islationism. There will be some renegotiation whereby everyone saves face, but we could have had the bulk of it without a referendum or the economic blip and that would have been enough to head off an exit vote.
A cynic might say that is what we’ve just voted for.
But that would do your argument a disservice so I’ll not forward that point of view.
I will say that with respect, you don’t talk actually talk for the people on the Brexit side - such that you can quantify those that have that view. I should also acknowledge that you could be correct.
But whilst that might be your sense now, after 6 months of the remaining EU states playing hardball in divorce settlements, and with the certain divisions that will appear within our country (as they have on this forum), I could quite easily see those that voted Brexit with their emotions rather than their heads will be for building walls and telling those that don’t like ‘us’ to fuck off and do one.
Whether that would be a widely held view or not is moot, but we’ve seen that our politicians will align themselves with the prevailing sentiment to get elected, so I wouldn’t dismiss any possible outcome from this vote.
Absolutely agree with your last point. A referendum was not necessary - per the piece (I think) you shared yesterday.
Interestingly Merkel is already making concilatory noises
Meanwhile on negotiations, German Chancellor Angela Merkel said: “It shouldn’t take forever, that’s right, but I would not fight for a short time frame.”
She added that she was seeking a “objective, good” climate in talks on Britain’s exit from the EU, and that there was no need to make deterrence a priority.
Mrs Merkel also said there was “no need to be particularly nasty in any way in the negotiations; they must be conducted properly”.
Of course she is, CB Saint.
The currency and financial markets are global. If the pound tanks, her manufacturing-led economy will struggle to export to us.
But what will be the position of the remaining countries when they see other countries wanting to follow the British path?
OK, no problem, just make sure you wipe your feet on the way out.
or
Remember how Britain has suffered by voting to leave, do you want the same thing to happen to you?
?
My intentionally dramatic separation of the poles of the argument fails to recognise a lot of the grey, but you’d surely have to acknowledge that Merkel’s public position today, isn’t likely to be the same when push comes to shove.
I mean, if ever there was a chance for the EU to show us some flexibility, it was when the pig fucker went cap-in-hand.
That didn’t play so well.
So now we’ve told them that we don’t want to see them anymore and that it’s not them, it’s us, how do we think we’re going to get a positive reception?
In the shit-storm that will follow this, it will be every man for herself.
Whilst being publicly supportive of Britain is in the remaining states’ interest, they will be publicly supportive.
When that stops being the case, I would expect them to look out for their own national interest and they will stop being supportive.
Either way, we’ve just pressed the button marked “Gamble with your future”, and nobody, nobody, knows what will happen next.
1 Like
I also have no interest in a second vote - people who wanted out, they’ve got it.
I’ll lose business, as many will - I say that as a fact because one of my clients lost a fortune on their share price on Friday - cuts will follow as clear as day follows night.
Also a new PM who is Leave-friendly will be to the right of the current set-up, so there is the potential for further austerity measures should our great new world not deliver prosperity.
Still not bothered?
If your income is linked at all to banks, or to big companies who could relocate or make cuts, those actions still cause a spending knock-on effect right down to the local high street, and to local trades.
Still not bothered? Looking forward to China and India jumping when Boris clicks his fingers?
Yep, mighty England is off to conquer the world, we’ll have 50 new hospitals and a fucking empire by Christmas.
If people still can’t see beyond the ridiculous claims of Johnson and Farage they are beyond educating.
From a selfish point of view I’m doing okay, so I could sit with popcorn watching the stupid justify voting away their future, after all, the strong will survive.
But that might come across as someone who looks down on fuckwits, and I wouldn’t want to do that.
8 Likes
Merkel could still be scrambling to rescue the nobel peace prize she gambled the EU for.
Interesting view point on why Article 50 hasn’t yet been invoked.
1 Like
Seems to link to a general feed and not the specific article you mentioned.
1 Like