You’re doing a huge disservice to all the tradesmen out there that take pride in their work, especially those that have been through an apprenticeship system.
Oddly enough, we’re likely to have even more crap builders when freedom of movement ends. Why? Because why train youngsters when you can just pluck someone cheaper that has been trained elsewhere.
Why would youngsters bother when they hear the sneering of the professional classes decrying their trade and their ability in it?
We’ve paid 45bn extra into the IMF since the Greek bailouts began.
It’s _probably _a coincidence. The IMF _probably _needed paperclips or something.
The fact remains. We indirectly financed the Greek bailouts. We directly financed the Irish We indirectly financed the Spanish.
This isn’t some tangential line of thinking, AG. If the Guardian is happy enough to list our IMF contributions to financing the Spanish bailout, would sir care to explain why I can’t?
I’m also both amused and annoyed at being told to “get my story straight” by a man who has difficulty getting a single post straight, presumably because it’s typed in a furious frenzy. If you’re dyslexic I apologise in advance.
To run a business the way I see it not actually work in building and civil construction?
Poles possibly came here as Germany was saturated with their labour?
I can just imagine a fully extenstive building apprenticeship program in Spain and Portugal.
All this Country wants is calls centres for banks not paying tax here, service industry is globalisation, we make nothing anymore and import cheap Chineses and Indian crap from crap metal.
Sorry but that deserves a fuck off - you are now making stuff up and suggesting things that I have never said… ‘sneering professional classes’ - listen to yourself. Where have I sneered ? - Its you doing the fucking sneering at anyone who seems to recoignise Brexit was NOT a simple black or White issue… You sound like one of those tossers selling Socialist Worker outside the Student union… most folk probably agreeing with what they are saying, but cant stand the pious patroniszing way they present it… The point I have made is that in Germany, an EU country, because of the legislative training requirments it makes those trades highly valued - they ARE a professional class, there is no difference. I am talking about the countless untrained in thsis country, not those that are… its why the Poles did such a good trade because they were better than our untrained…
You seem to belive that twisting a point might help you make a point… but its just dilutes it even further… 
We haven’t done anything with our skilled and highly skilled apprenticeships for years we’ve been in the EU, I don’t see your point, we don’t make anything anymore bar a few foreign based highly expensive aircraft, guns, bombs, wing tips and things that kill people now, since Thatcher our manufactoring base has been decimated and do the Germans subsidise their key industries and workers?
We’re a bunch of free market bellends.
The only stuff we make now is stuff we don’t trust other people to make., like the arms industry you mention, Every large scale car manufacturer is foreign owned, and the jobs are usually under threat of being moved elsewhere.
The difference between Germany and the UK is investment. The German economy has consistently had more money put into it than we have in the manufacturing sector for decades.
France has had more investment too.
They always have done, thats not the EU but a national philosophy, we’re a tax dodging grubby little island that for the last 40 or more years done everything on the cheap or halfarsed, the EU in this argument is bollocks, look at our history of manufactoring and what we made, its as impressive as it is sad.
The EU didn’t save Fords in Southampton though did it?
BAE in Hamble is tiny now.
Vospers?
We can read scripted bollocks however about PPI, who ironically don’t pay tax here.
Quite the opposite.
THE Daily Echo can reveal today that a huge payout of EU cash was made to Fordjust before the company closed its Southampton plant – and it went to boost Transit production in Turkey.
This paper has already disclosed how £10m of UK Government cash was approved to help British Ford operations just days before the Swaythling bombshell was dropped.
And now we have learnt that a cheap £80m EU loan to ramp up production of Transit vans in Turkey was also signed off just months before Ford’s devastating Southampton announcement.
Exactly, cheap labour and the expansion East. Globalisation has really only benefitted the new order and not the old ones, the EU is an extension of that, it benefitted huge corps and Goverments but not people on the ground, population reduction and low tax receipts in some nations will be a huge problem soon.
It has also helped Ebay flogging absolutely poorly made knock offs…
I liked Jean-Claude Juncker, unelected President today, trying to be a man of the people with his bar room metaphor.
He reckons Britain is like someone trying to escape paying for a round of drinks.
In reality, we’ve got the rounds in more consistently than anyone except Germany. We’ve consistently been a net contributor. We’ve paid for our drinks, ta.
Its like Sky telling us football wasn’t here before 1992, they don’t mention we’re shitter now than we’ve ever been nationally and domestically.
Ramification of Brexit. The complete loss of confidence in the Conservative Party and its power as an electoral force. The second stringers were bad enough.
Over to Peston.
“Theresa May will be gone by Christmas”.
Not my words. Those of a minister - who says that the past week has seen a shattering of the conceit that her continuation as PM till after we Brexit in March 2019 is the best guarantee of relative stability in unpredictable times for her party and country.
Barely a day has passed since the summer holidays that has been unmarked by ministerial strife and bickering, which has normally been some version of Boris and Gove Vs Hammond or Hammond Vs Boris and Gove.
To be clear, this instability is not about personal ambition, or rather not just the irresistible desire of the predatory male politician to finish off a wounded prime minister.
If anything it is more about the appallingly unfinished business for the Tories of working out what kind of Brexit they want.
Her perhaps fatal weakness is that she lacks the authority to settle this argument, such that the rest of the EU would have a clear understanding of who actually represents the UK and what we want from Brexit.
In the words of a senior member of the cabinet, it is a scandal that there has never been a cabinet discussion about what kind of access we want to the EU’s market once we leave, what kind of regulatory and supervisory regime should then be in place to ensure a level playing field for EU and UK businesses, and - don’t gasp - how much we might actually pay to the EU as the so-called divorce bill.
In the absence of a settled government position on these most basic of our Brexit demands, it is little short of a miracle that the leaked draft of a possible EU council statement actually holds out the possibility of the EU itself beginning to mull the form of possible trade and transition deals with us.
To be clear, it has been her ordinance that there should be no cabinet discussion of all this. And if the prime minister lacks the power and authority to negotiate Brexit with her own ministers - who after all are supposed to be on the same side as her - what possible chance is there of her reaching any kind of entente with 27 EU governments?
What should trouble her profoundly is that even those who just a week ago were savaging Boris for his disloyalty, or who detest his Brexit dogmatism, now say little could be worse than the status quo - and that as he seems to own a torch and a stick, they’d rather have him.
To be clear, I am not saying Boris Johnson will be PM within weeks. But I am saying that I no longer regard that as an absurd notion.
None of this clap trap is giving me an enormous sense of wellbeing (musos spot the reference). In fact, all pap and Bazza are doing is reinforcing my sense of unease. If you guys are trying to reassure me, it’s not working. I would love to be reassured but, at the moment, all I see is chaos 
Europe is dead due to the rise of globalisation and cheap labour, us on our own simply makes it our own choice of dying, hopefully a bit more slowly.
You’re really putting some effort into cheering Bs up by admitting you voted for our death, with the only upside being, you predict this way will make it a prolonged death.
Why do you think it’s better to die slowly and alone?
Or die of your own choosing, whatever way you want to look at it I suppose.
Ffs RB at least get facts right.
It was a Parrot that got buried
Then everything makes sense.
Clearly the original choice of Parrot was a Norwegian Version and Blue but that seems to have gone into the usual muddle of trying to keep a joob rather than do the right thing for the country.
What IS encouraging, is that Political debate is starting to open upp again, after the years of Neo_liberal centrist Blair?Dave politics.
Not yet discussing strategy so not discussing doctrines or ideas in the new world order, but it’s a start.
Now if you could just get away from arguing about numbers and working out what the fuck you actually need to do to get a negotiated settlement
(fire May imho and replace her with a professional but that ain’t gonna happen any time soon)