As you know, I am somewhat sceptical of the EU. Thing is, I don’t think that much needs to change in order for it to be fit for purpose.
If the EU did these things, I’d be an unqualified yes.
democratically elected executive branch
funding for infrastructure demands that we face
ditch the commitment to privately funding infrastructure
ditch TTIP
place the needs of citizens first, banks later
The problem is that I don’t see much or any of that happening. There are couple of problems with 1). First, it means fessing up that we’re not real countries anymore. Second, I imagine those in the EU commission quite like the present arrangements.
The infrastructure funding is politically easier to achieve, but will be fought by those that say we should be trying to harmonise the continent first. I just don’t understand the obstacles surrounding publicly funding your infrastructure. They only make sense if the EU is a gigantic fucking businessman’s club, which it is. The zeal with which TTIP is being adopted is another exhibit making the case.
Finally, citizens first. This has been such a wasted opportunity on that front. While the EU has helped its citizens in many incremental ways, it hasn’t done enough and acted appallingly with consideration to Greece and Portugal. We know that there is no reason for any citizen in the EU to go hungry, and yet they do. There is enough space in Britain so that no-one need be homeless. There’s certainly enough room in the EU.
The comparison of “what it is” vs “what it could be” is blooming depressing. It could be an example to the world of how long term peace is achieved, an advertisement for human values which might end up becoming indelible generations down the line, as if we’d never known any different. Imagine how great it would be if the EU could boast “we ended hunger on our continent”. Now contrast that with the reality of Greece.
I agree with Corbyn that it could be a force for progressive change, and who knows? Maybe a more constructive approach will lead to that. My instincts tell me that the EU won’t change itself willingly.
We have been saying staying in only could change the EU, nothing has changed and we’ve been saying that since the 70’s, Johnson is correct in saying the people who want the same say its crap but its the only choice we have, we dont its crap will stay crap and will always be crap.
Its fat undemocratic and also crap.
Its set up for big corps so heaven knows why then the left (who were always ands many still are but due to the shite nature of politics can’t actually speak their mind) want in, employment rights? Bollocks, absolute crap they were won before entry in the 70’s or many of them were.
Its a lie, farce and fiddle.
The good news is in the last 10 years we have become more entrenched and far more sceptical of this EU beast and it will continue regardless of the vote, people will not stop now until such reform is asked we’ll be asked to leave or have another referendum, I love it.
People are not bought off with people retiring in Spain with money (could do that anyway), working in the EU (could do that anyway) and such other things tariffs (won’t they want our goods and we theirs?).
Its getting ugly as their arguments are falling apart.
The things that would turn you in to a yes voter won’t and will never happen, the inners keep saying stay in and change but it never does and it never will.
Leaving will help other nations as well as they will want reform.
I think I’ve already agreed that the EU probably won’t reform itself, but we’re talking hypotheticals here. I’m merely wondering if there is any shape of European Union you would find acceptable.
The things that would turn you in to a yes voter won’t and will never happen, the inners keep saying stay in and change but it never does and it never will. Leaving will help other nations as well as they will want reform.
I think I’ve already agreed that the EU probably won’t reform itself, but we’re talking hypotheticals here. I’m merely wondering if there is any shape of European Union you would find acceptable.
Hmmm yes for sure on many things but obviously wnating one thing would mean conceding on another, we have too much to concede and not enough to gain, I have said if alldropped National agendas and fully bought into a European super state it could work, that wont happen so a union is simply on a piece of paper as we still have self interest, The United States of America still have huge regional interest after over 200 years, it would take 1000’s of years to dissolve ours and others.
Three interviews focusing on the EU. If Corbyn is getting criticised for not going balls out enthusiasm for the EU, then surely Yvette Cooper deserves a bit of flak for the piss-poor case she makes here. She’s just so robotic, and while I’d love to see a female Labour leader at some point, I think the party dodged a bullet by not electing her.
French economy minister Emmanuel Macron makes a more passionate case which is part love letter, part poison pen. He opens by saying he really wants us to stay in, but he spends much of the rest of the interview (at Marr’s behest) speaking about the problems that a Brexit may bring.
Finally, Chris Grayling comes out to bat for Leave. Does a reasonable job of dismantling some of the arguments surrounding tariffs, etc. Reckons there is no sensible reason to do this, as it would be self-destructive. Uses the example of French farmers exporting to British markets, and asks why the French government would place this constraint on their exports. Emmanuel Macron’s previous claims that Calais would be closed down post Brexit also got a bit of a rebuttal too.
Was initially confused by this post. Probably doesn’t help that GO stands for both George Osborne and Grassroots Out.
Listened to him being interviewed on Radio 4 this morning. The new scare phrase is “permanently poorer”, based on assumptions and a 14 year forecast trading on those assumptions.
“We would not all be in this together if we left the EU. The richest in our country would go on being rich, it would be the poorest - the people whose jobs depend on the car plants, whose jobs depend on the steel-making factories and the like - who would be hit if we left the European Union,” he said.
“They are the people whose incomes would go down, whose house prices would fall, whose job prospects will weaken. They are the people who always suffer when the country takes an economic wrong term.”
Sounds much like he’s got Brexit confused with vote Conservative Party to me
